Patek Philippe

Miranda
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Patek: Finish and perception of quality

In this post, I wish to address the elephant in the room – finishing and the perceived poor value from Patek Philippe (PP). There have been repeated posts regarding PP, that I have let go, but statements such as “overhyped mass market products” was the straw that broke this camel’s back. 

Firstly let me make it quite clear, I am not affiliated/paid/ambassador for PP. 

I have a long relationship as a collector yes, and as a journalist before I came here at WPS. But I have weakness- I don’t suffer fools gladly- something that’s gets worse the older I get.

Now I am going to address issues around finishing etc. FOR THE LAST TIME.

The finishing on a PP is at least on a par with anything I have seen through a loop from VC,AP, Breguet and Duometre from JLC. The rest of JLC is definitely in a lower tier. Many perceive the finish in an ALS as superior, however they either don’t know the difference of - or fail to get their head around the difference between the softer German silver used in an ALS (and Philippe Dufour) and rhodium plated brass. PD himself told me in an interview I did for 002/24 magazine, that German silver is much easier to work with and in time gives a nice patina. BUT it’s not as hard as brass. So visually the anglage is lost partly to the plating, but also do you want anglage for the sake of anglage? Its purpose is not be just aesthetically pleasing, but to prevent wear over time. Finishing on the cases is as good as anything I have seen in the industry and bracelets are exemplary. Having seen how many hours of work go into polishing a Nautilus case and bracelet, the amount of human input is unbelievable. 

A complete case and bracelet takes the best part of 10-12 hours of hand finishing.

Then there are the dials- I did post on the dial manufacture and the quality of the dial production in Fluckiger- again so much hand finishing. What I did not state as PP specifically asked me not to, was that they make the dials for most of the prestigious manufactures……

Then there is the over-priced accusation. The prices are on a par with brands of a similar stature, AP, VC, Breguet etc. If you can get cheaper in the grey market for those other brands, then that is an issue for those brands not PP. The fact that much less  Patek ends up on the grey market means better residual values in the longer term. I know for a fact AP are actively reducing AD’s to counteract the grey market position.

So I can only deduce that when the complaints come in about finish, PP are being compared to the likes or Ferrier, Voutilainen, Rexhepi or Forsey. Actually that’s a compliment to the reputation of Patek. In that case yes they are better finished, but a Chronometre from Rexhepi is CHF 58k, that gets you an annual calendar at PP. Hardly a like for like comparison. Would you pay an extra CHF20k for a PD esque quality finish on a time only mechanical watch from PP??  Is that even the market for PP? Just so you know, now that PD is not selling any more pieces, I think Rexhepi is the best finish you can buy.

That’s just my opinion.

For an in depth look at the cal 240- have a look at this wonderful expose from Walt Odets. 

He also reviews the base cal.215.

http://www.timezone.com/2002/09/16/patek-philippes-bread-and-butter-the-caliber-215/

http://www.users.cloud9.net/~bradmcc/240/index.html

I wish to address some points from Alex25- he said to me in his words- “I am pretty sure I know more about watches than you do. Especially in technical aspects”.

1.    Inadequate pricing- not sure what he meant, it actually means not priced high enough. I am sure he meant overpriced. Compare the RRP with AP, ALS ….you do the maths

2.    Poor mvt architecture- e.g. four pushers for the calendar: the ref 3940 pertpetual has been around since the 1980’s, so has the 3970 perpetual calendar chronograph. The annual calendar came in 1996- how many complaints about pushers breaking???? I’ve not heard anything. So a nonsense statement. Four pushers have been around since the 1930’s- those watches are still going strong from many manufacturers such as Rolex, Universal, Omega and Heuer to name but a few.

3.    Aftersales service: have you compared with other brands, there is a shortage of watchmakers, this is an industry problem. I don’t believe PP is any worse than anyone else, where are the statistics to prove otherwise?

4.    Very few own movements- LOL, really??? Probably the dumbest statement ever made in the forum, and I have been here over a decade. ALL OF THE CURRENT COLLECTION HAS INHOUSE MOVEMENTS.

5.    Quality of finish degraded over time: having owned many vintage and modern: I can say for sure some vintage have a wonderful level of finish- just like some modern too, but I have seen vintage with a decent finish that is superior but not “wow”- depends on the calibre and model

6.    Little technical innovation- 1996 annual calendar, Spiromax , silinvar, gyromax balance, annual calendar regulator, slimmest split second chronograph, slimmest perpetual with automatic rotor, 10 days movement etc. etc. etc.

7.    False information: like Rolex takes a year to make a watch 😀

8.    When did they make their own chronograph? Uhmm the 5170/5270/5959 etc…….. with new patents

Alex25 based his arguments on PP making 50-60K watches per year, as do many others . What they forget is 40% is ladies 24 quartz. If you look at the investment PP has made in watchmakers (Rexhepi is a PP graduate) the actual ratio of watchmakers to mechanical watches has stayed approximately the same since the 1990’s.

So there you have it. I will not satisfy the haters of course, but I don’t really care about that. This forum is for sharing passion about PP from owners and enthusiasts. It is NOT a soap box for haters. Find somewhere else to vent off your frustrations.