cazalea
[Seiko Moderator]
20948
Conversations with people in the inner circle
Look, as PuristSPro (this site a few years ago) there were moderators who were offered "test drives" of expensive watches. Most of those were returned; some were not. Hence we had to come up with a policy that nothing could be accepted without disclosure to the Mgmt and approval. Such things happen in many industry and it's those "influencers" that the IRS and other US agencies have gone after for making money hand over fist for favorable reviews OR "approval copies" of the products.
Heck, even I have been offered good prices, special models, one-off deals, etc. and I'm far from being a social media influencer. And no, I didn't take any of the deals.
I know car reviewers who have not owned a car in decades because they drive the OEM's cars for free, rotating them week to week. They don't get to keep the cars but they get to use them, which is even better.
It's a tangled web of deceit out there ... make no mistake about that.
Cazalea
Hypothetical question.
If a watch is released in a limited edition of 250 pieces by a well known watch blog, and is apparently sold out “in minutes” to a group of “dedicated collectors”, but 10 of them are immediately available on eBay with a 50% markup on as BNIB, my question ...
I doubt it is insider trading.
It is disturbing but this is what happens with any product sold online with predictable demand and limited supply. It has been going on for years with sneakers, bags, bourbon,... Watch retail is years behind but we will see more and more of that happening...
It’s a well-known secret that hodinkee was never in it for the passion
. Okay, maybe it started off with a passion but they quickly capitalized on it. I don’t blame them though; it’s a free world and people can choose to not seek these hodinkee special editions.
I’d guess it’s just opportunistic people
A few people in my collectors circles are ordering these HODINKEE watches with a “maybe I’ll keep it, probably I’ll sell it” attitude. I’m in Canada, so I’m sure flipping is even more rampant in the US where customs issues are less likely to eat into flip...
My only issue with thinking these are opportunistic people, is that because these editions sell out so fast, I doubt "professional flippers" would get a chance to buy them before passionate watch enthusiasts.
My thinking is that it is probably "friends and family" or Hodinkee staff (or some of their preferred customers who buy 3 or 5 before the allocation is announced and then dump the "excess stock" at marked up prices to take advantage of the bubble. I could...
I don't think this is true...
and is for sure not limited to Hodinkee. Is just a supply and demand reality.
So, why are folks convinced that Hodinkee is passionless about watches all of a sudden?
I'm really not following the comments here suggesting that Hodinkee's staff aren't passionate watch enthusiasts, just because their company also sells watches. I (like I'm sure most people here), read most things I can get my hands on around horology, inc...
I’ll answer the question in your first sentence-at least from my perspective.
I do think Hodinkee is less about horological passion these days. I believe the passion has been replaced by a drive to make money. Hodinkee has for a long time had a shop; selling mainly inexpensive items but now and then supplemented with a ridiculously...
If it leaves a bad taste in your mouth, walk away
No offense meant if you truly like this watch, but to me this is a total derivative 'also-ran' watch. It looks just like a seamaster 300, a tudor bb, or a blancpain ff. Basically an attempt to cash in on the 'in' style, which just so happens to be promote...
Actually, this LE was not at all to my taste, but I only used it to make a point.
I have owned a Hodinkee Nomos LE in the past, so don't have anything in particular against the blog. It is informative and well-produced, but I was trying to make a point that there is a potential conflict of interest.
This! ^^^^^
They must be doing something right as the Brands wouldn't be creating collab watches with them if they didn't sell. They obviously can create designs that buyers want (both passionate ones and flippers). I bought 3 of these Hodinkee x Manufacture watches:...
Good perspective
I have also been a buyer of the H limited editions, including the 10th Anniversary Speedmaster. I bought it with the "maybe I'll keep it, maybe I'll sell it" mentality. I ultimately didn't love it, tried to flip it, and didn't get much interest on C24 whe...
A very good point, amanico!
Hodinkee is a good example of a company creating a "perfect storm" of creating the product, marketing the product, generating interest within a committed collecting community and then selling it. I guess most watch companies do not have a screen of "edito...
Not their in-house staff; it’s the friends pre-sale
Hodnkee has done a pre-sale setup where friends of Clymer & co get to reserve/purchase the LE watch before the general public. The general public release is likely never the full lot of units available. I would guess more than a few friends are dealers an...
Conversations with people in the inner circle
Look, as PuristSPro (this site a few years ago) there were moderators who were offered "test drives" of expensive watches. Most of those were returned; some were not. Hence we had to come up with a policy that nothing could be accepted without disclosure ...
Thanks, Cazalea!
That broadly confirms my suspicions and thoughts on this issue. It is a muddy world, and the separation of Editorial and Advertising is disappearing. Not a good direction.
I know for a fact that this is true [nt]
Happy to let you know details at the next meetup (-:
VC
Exactly. I wanted to buy from them the VC and I put it in bascket in the first 30 sec but I didn't receive the confirmation of the order. I wrote them about it and no answer. From that point I dont like them. Lenrock
Speedy Tuesdays are a good example...
They are sold out within minutes and Omega do not flip them... Flippers exist, Rolex Pepsi is a good example... a lot of people buy them just to sell them the next day.. Some people buy watches for enjoyment, others try to make a profit... Cheer ps. And a...
There is somethin to be said about flippers who buy Rolex Pepsis and Batmans just to flip them the next day; although, I doubt it is as much of a problem as some people say.
A wait list for a Steel Rolex model is a couple of years, and most individuals can only buy 1 - so not much of a business. My own opinion is this happens on an industrial scale with big groups, that get allocations of 100s directly from Rolex, and 50% of ...
The main problem I have is that brands are creating homage/replicas of Vintage Rolexes....
Tudor, Oris and many others are obviously involved which reduces my interest in them as it shows a lack of creativity and individuality. Only the real deal can be the real deal. No replica or homage can ever give you the same satisfaction ever. S
To me it is more a situation of speculators riding on Hodinkee´s audience and appeal,
and trying to cash in on it asap, much like the people buying Rolex professional models, Patek Phillipe Nautilus, and AP Jumbo´s who flip them as soon as they leave the store. In the particular case of the special editions, kudos to H for doing them and t...
We all have advantages that come with our jobs, who we know, our families etc.
I really don’t have any issue with the fact that “friends and family” get first dibs on these watches. The team / management at Hodinkee are more than entitled to give preference to certain people. Every watch manufacturer we know does that every day of t...
I guess, the lack of "transparency" is a problem for me.
Obviously, they do what they want, but at some point, customers will wise up to this (hopefully). No one likes being a sucker!
Who is a sucker? You get the watch at retail and you’re happy, you don’t get it and you decide to pay a premium. I don’t see the sucker here to be honest.
Their marketing or hype, which may allow for watches to sell out or and for those same watches to command a premium in the secondary market, is credit to them. Every watch manufacturer/ brand / retailer does this and if they seem to be doing a better job ...
Interesting Post
Like to read such stuff. Difficult to leave here because of straightforward members like you. Thanks Bounce781
Thank you, Teacher Yang; but you give me too much credit.
I was merely musing aloud and the rest were frank responses from members. But you are correct. we have great members here who express opinions freely - which is why THIS is the only forum I come to. HAGWE!
I disagree....all watch companies are in for the money
I did buy some Hodinkee LE in the past (also the second on the Zenith that was truly limited and lately the IWC) and the whole argument that they would be not passionate because they make money on it is a bit absurd. Isn't Rolex in for the money with the ...
I think there are 2 separate issues which are getting conflated in this conversation.
1) I don't claim Hodinkee is not passionate about watches, and are only driven by $$$. I believe they do good work, and are an undeniably important part of the horological media landscape. I personally believe a conflict of interest exists when a media co...
Why do you say that...
great IWC was not a hit? It was sold out almost immediately and there is still a demand for it... Cheers
I got super lucky as when I finally made up my mind the IWC x Hodinkee was sold out
So I said "What the heck?" and put my name on the "waiting list". Lo and behold, a day later I got an email that someone cancelled their order and one was available if I wanted it. I'm glad I took the chance and clicked on that waiting list button It's on...