ChristianDK
[F.P. Journe Moderator]
15059
That was exactly the song I was thinking about, Pelle
I am a HUGE Nick Cave fan. I have listened to this album a thousand times. I lost my father a few months ago and the words are perfect because they give me something to hold on to, in something I will have to accept but is very difficult to understand.
Regarding Nick Cave we share this enthusiasm. He has been part of the soundtrack to my life since my teenage years in Melbourne. I have learned so much from him over the years. In my early years as a young architect about handling the creative process and the difficult struggle it sometimes just is. Later when he lost his son Arthur, he was able to reinvent himself to become someone who had much more of his personal self invested. In his songs and writings, he is truly generous and positive. His thoughts about getting something good out of life and also his intelligent way of dealing with loss and grief. He has pointed out how loss and grief are a part of being human and it has made it more easy for me to accept.
The masters desk on exhibition in Copenhagen dec 2020.
Your thoughts on watches resonate with me. Everything we surround ourselves with these days is so fleeting and ever changing. Made with very little care. A watch is one of the very few items that are personal. Also because you wear the watch. Day after day in all kinds of situations. I’m sure your son and his children will understand your message when it’s their turn to take care of your watch.
Pelle, thank you for your very kind words and for sharing your thoughts. My great Swedish brother!
Pelle, thank you for your very kind words and for sharing your thoughts. My great Swedish brother!
Passing down a Patek... does it succeed?
Not every Patek owner has a successful, responsible son who loves high horology and is dreaming of the day that his Father will bequeath the family heirloom to him to cherish forever. Never to leave the bloodline. Through feast, famine, financial hardship...
Great question!
I’m even concerned about them getting big time low-balled by a dealer when they go to sell them😬
It's my goal (and great hope!) that they will NOT sell them... EVER!
Wish I could etch some kind of message on the back "Always keep in our blood line!" LOL! With fashion/luxury conscious daughters (worldwide) for example... when it comes to beautiful jewelry for the wrist - many females will imagine a lovely bracelet stac...
Now that you mention it, I can reasonably see daughters understanding and valuing watches for what they are…
and more so because they are dad’s watches. It’s the boys that I have less confidence in, unless they have a clear appreciation for such things…at least Pateks.
Armis, I agree that the natural maturity of young ladies is superior to young men!
And the young ladies will have the empathy to comprehend the family importance. Best, Robert
How lovely to have daughters
I have only 1 Patek but 3 daughters. My great grand father celebrated his golden wedding anniversary by offering 2 identical PP2573 to his two sons in the seventies. I inherited both but only kept my grand uncle with whom I had a better personal relations...
Vin, thank you so much for sharing
Your lovely daughters surely anticipate that moment! Beautiful story about your great grand father.
What happens when the highly responsible and financially disciplined father has taken great pains to keep a Patek for his son/daughter?
The highly responsible and financially disciplined father who has taken great pains to keep a Patek should have invested that money wisely. 🧐
I subscribe to this philosophy.
My goal is to pass down watches in the context of other assets.
I think it’s a fun idea/hypothetical question….
Although for me, totally out of the question as I have neither a Patek nor kids…lol But I think there is a romantic idea of passing down something that we ourselves love, be it money, possessions or that failure of a sports team we’ve stuck by far too lon...
Passing them on
Here is what have done for my 7 grandchildren (5 boys 2 girls). I don’t have PPs but for the boys Rolex’s and the girls Cartier’s each with their name engraved on the back along with a “❤️ Papa”. Also an understanding that the watches will never leave the...
Wow, you could not have done it better!
I’m sure they will love them forever and I believe that wonderful engraving will make them love their watches forever. Perhaps provide a little loving reminder (and slight peer pressure amongst the grandkids) to not sell them or give them to someone who d...
Beautiful 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Engraving is something I’ve thought about and would like to do. But i would still first want an indication that they would value the watch, especially being thoughtfully personalized like that.
ArmisT, I agree!
What are your thoughts on how to go about that indication that they would value the watch. I can imagine that any person would express gratitude and positive emotion at the spector of receiving an expensive watch. At your convenience please do tell ArmisT...
It’s kinda funny because I’ve sometimes wondered how much true passion does Thierry Stern’s kids have for watches and Patek watches 🤔
Nonetheless, to get back in scope of our realities, I just try to initially gauge a general interest by sharing my basic appreciation for watches…and I watch for reactions like paying attention, asking questions, or even a “that’s cool”, as opposed to zon...
ArmisT, thank you so much for that explanation.
That is a great way to gauge (even though we watch lovers would consider that a very low set of expectations!) a young person's interest. Thierry children may not understand or appreciate their level of royalty in the world of high horology... but your ap...
There's a movie scene...
...in the 9th Gate, where the kids are squabbling over the Father's book collection, a stroke victim, when the protagonist played by Johnny Depp shows up and makes off with a prized set of books for a lowball price. The poor old man is drooling with anger...
Aelred - you are a realist! Love it! :-)
Wise words and well paraphrased for the current platforms. Best, Robert
Im Thinking its a bad idea to leave them the whole collection
Unless they become watch collectors with same taste as me but they are still very young. A watch for each is more reasonable and I have some pieces in mind that I have worn the most. Something they would have seen regularly on my wrist.
That's a blessing Tony!
Do your children express favorites like "I get the Patek! Okay but I get the Rolex!" Best, Robert
I’ve already gifted them many watches. They enjoy them. But they have their eyes on a few.
The real problem comes in when you have to start servicing all these expensive pieces. In the last year, I probably have moved along at least 26 pieces. Of course I substituted a couple, but you have to start thinning a herd after a while.
You totally lost me at the 'responsible' part. 🤩😁🤣😂 Plus my wife's collection, while far smaller, is incredibly well chosen.
As for our daughter, she wears a nice hand-me-down elegant Rolex Presidential, which was my mother's. Sales pitches and heartstring tugging stories aside, the good news is the more youthful demographics desire a fine timepiece, and are learning great know...
Enjoy - thank you for your input
Your lovely daughter is truly blessed with her Presidential from her Sainted Grandmother. What an absolute thrill to receive such a timepiece. Your family, if I may say so, sounds not on successful but very wise. Best, Robert
From my perspective, leaving something as an inheritance to our children shouldn't become a burden for them.
It's an act of love, and they should be free to do what they want with it. Boy or girl, it doesn't matter; if they decide to sell the watch or watches we've carefully passed on to them, well, so be it. These watches will continue their lives in a differen...
I think you’re exactly right, Emmanuel
I have a couple of watches I’m thinking about giving my sons when they grow up but…it’s up to them what they do with them. What they will do with my watches wouldn’t be my first priority. Its way down the list. Foremost, I would hope that they spend their...
But of course Christian and very well spoken.
That is the more important aspect of humanity. Best, Robert
Thank you Robert.
I am, of course hoping that they will cherish what I leave for them. But I do see Emmanuel’s point that it mustn’t be a burden. I think that has to do with the value also. I have gold Omegas from both my grandfathers and they are loved and to me priceless...
Christian, very well put. Gold Omegas must be wonderful to hold - knowing your Grandfather's lovingly passed them down in the family
For example, if someone was holding early Nautilus references that are auction worthy (Phillips, Christies, Sotheby's) that might be a constant anxiety due to the high liquidity at the ready to solve immediate financial concerns. Thank you for your great ...
Yes, exactly that. And then could be become a burden..
Too valuable to wear and enjoy. They feel guilty about selling when they need the funds. Thank you Robert for raising this discussion. It is something I regularly think about. Im thinking it’s also important that it is something that they see on my wrist....
Well written Christian - thank you for your insight
There are so many variables and utterly uncontrollable moments that it's best to decide at a later point when closer to the actual moment of giving. Best, Robert
Very well put.
However, after seeing Emmanuels excitement about his grandfathers JLC, I’m grateful that this hobby of ours can also be a very emotional one to be shared with our loved ones if they are so inclined.
As you say, Derreck, when our children share our passion and are delighted with the watches we pass on to them,
it's a great pleasure and we have every reason to be grateful. But if that's not the case, the most important thing is that they are good people with strong human qualities. Best, Emmanuel
I couldn't agree more with you, Christian.
What makes me truly happy is seeing that my children have become people whom I deeply respect for their human qualities, their kindness, their consideration for others, and their integrity. What they do with my watches when I'm no longer here is really of...
Yes, agreed Emmanuel. I'm conscious not to foist my stuff and my passions onto my daughter. If she likes watches, great, if not she should sell them and spend the money on something she loves.
To Robert's original post, when I was looking to buy my grail watch I selected several models I loved and then involved my daughter in the final choice, a PP5236. My daughter does seem to genuinely like the watch, even if she is not particularly keen on m...
Jon, well said and congratulations on the dual appreciation of your beautiful 5236 Perpetual Calendar!
Your lovely daughter is blesed to have you as a father. All the best, Robert
Going this route with the purchase of your grail watch was an excellent idea, Jon.
It was a lovely way to involve your daughter while giving her complete freedom to do as she pleases when she will be responsible for your collection. And the ref. 5236 is a wonderful choice too! Best, Emmanuel
Emmanuel, yes it's impossible to work the puppet strings from the grave...
Thank you for your thoughtful input. Sounds like your blessed children are very stable and have their father's great love of horology. Best, Robert
Thank you, Robert.
As Christian said, the most important thing is that our children become good people with strong human qualities. What they do with our watches is secondary. At least it is for me. Best, Emmanuel
Interesting question
I my opinion it can be applied to not only watches but to other things that has a significant emotional value. I am thinking of art for example or in my case music instruments with a unique (provenance) history - some that are just one of a kind and if so...
Pelle, that engraving is POWERFUL and emotional beyond words
From a purely human perspective, a gifted watch with that highly personal engraving is like super glue. Best, Robert
Pelle, that is really wonderful
And the engraving in brilliant! It is exactly what I hope my boys will feel. And the idea that it can continue makes it even better. Really brilliant and beautiful! Did you put it in English or did you put it in Swedish?
Many thanks Christian
Yes the engraving is in English. I have always liked Nick Cave and at one time when listening to his beautiful album Gosteen and hearing him saying/singing I am beside you it struck me as a perfect engraving.on a watch that is going to be passed on to nex...
That was exactly the song I was thinking about, Pelle
I am a HUGE Nick Cave fan. I have listened to this album a thousand times. I lost my father a few months ago and the words are perfect because they give me something to hold on to, in something I will have to accept but is very difficult to understand. Re...
Thanks for a brilliant post!
I read it a couple of times and find it very interesting, The way you talk about yourself, your father, NC and in addition to that some great pictures is not often seen here. Your kind words in the end is highly appreciated. Very best regards. Pelle
Hmm I try not to think that far...
I mean I don't even know what tomorrow holds, especially with the geopolitical tensions and volatility we are seeing now. 😥
I have 3 beautiful daughters.....
And when my Mom passed away 8 years ago, it put certain things into perspective, one of them being my small watch collection. So I passed on to each of them a Rolex watch. And to this date, each has still got a Rolex, though a bit of err fine tuning had t...
Your blessed daughters are adorned with Rolexes!! Incredibly gracious of you Greenwillow
The very best for your wonderful family, Robert
Great subject.
Lots to ponder. I am enjoying reading the viewpoints. I have one son who is currently 7 so I hope this is not imminent and my thoughts may certainly change in time. My personal view, as mentioned in a reply above, is to have my watches included within the...
PW, if I may say so you and your son are blessed in so many ways
Your collection of pairs is outrageously impressive and goodness gracious EXTREMELY well curated. I not only salute you and your judgement, but it's a great lesson to share with forum members. The very best, Robert
Thanks.
You are blessed as well. Lovely daughters. Another thought I wanted to share was to give some context to them on where to sell if ever needed. I have a friend who inherited many things from a wealthy father. Cars, watches, artwork (all in multiples). He k...
Ah yes, the Cautionary Tale of Anthony Farrer... Horrendous!
Thank you so much for your input. Very good advice. Your gracious to share such kind words. The very best, Robert
Spanners!
As I sat at my father hospital bedside as he lay dying but still lucid he asked me the following question: “What will you do with my spanners?” I found this a very difficult question to answer as my interest in his 50yr old spanners was negligible. As the...
Possessions are our jailers - so true!
Stirling, your dear father treasured his spanners! Were his spanners more than just common tools/wrenches? Did you use them together and learn from him? Best, Robert
Spanners
I think his spanners meant a lot to him. They were excellent quality and probably dated back to the 1950s and his BSA motorbike. Sadly my father was absent for long periods of my youth so I didn’t see the spanners as of any sentimental value.
What a story Stirling!
Something we can all learn from, think. Thank you for sharing it.
On the topic of taking it with you
I read once that that Emperor Hirohioto took his M Mouse watch with him. In this context I thought I mention what some other famous wanted to bring with them. F Sinatra a pack of Camel/lighter, a bottle of Jack Daniels and finally 1 dollar in dimes in cas...
LOL! Thanks for the history lesson of "bringing it with you"
Very interesting! Best, Robert
Dear Robert,
This type of question is what really makes this forum great. For me it begins with giving the question some further thinking. Then it is time to answer it. After that things only get better when I can reflect on all various answers coming in. The fact tha...
What my father did is
buying to himself, me and my brother the same Rolex, so when we are together we all wear the same watch, cool idea I think.
Derreck you're sweet father is the envy of us all!
Master stroke! Three identical Rolexes. The man is smart, forward looking and oh so generous. The very best, Robert
Just one of the many things I worry about.
3 Daughters. 15, 13, 8. 6 Pateks and too many Rolex watches. And I want to buy each daughter a Rolex at 18. I have told my wife that if I get hit by a bus I have a friend ready to step in and acquire the entire collection at an honest price. So she doesn'...
U3, you've generated a storied life and so many achievements - I also hope your lovely daughters treasure your watches (especially the Pateks!)
Thank you so much for sharing. I wish I had a trusted friend who could sweep right in to help my wife negotiate the aftermarket environment... in the case of my demise. Your sweet daughters will surely grow into responsible young ladies with your guidance...
My perspective on gifts.
I believe there should be zero expectations tied to a gift for a loved one ( regardless of value ) giving it without an expectation is a full expression of love. Just my 2 cents.
Understood Larry, zero expectations as a true expression of love
Thank you so much for your input - worth so much more than 2 cents. The very best, Robert
Patrick, you have commissioned such a wonderful, lovely and intimate engraving for your musical grandson.
That beautiful Rolex Submariner will mean so very much to him! The very best, Robert
I don't want to burden...
...my lone child with disposing of a collection she will presumably have no interest in or knowledge of. I had to dispose of my father's various collections, and it was not an efficient process. I plan to sell off my collection in my later years and hand ...
David - wow, such a great idea... selling of the collection in your later years.
That serves multiple purposes and everyone should be very happy with that course of action. The very best to you, Robert
Personally I think it's kind of an unreasonable expectation
My dad is into watches but he doesn't really have anything I would want to wear. I have a bunch of his watches but I literally never wear them because they're not interesting haha. Even if it was a patek, I probably wouldn't wear it and it would just....c...
Yes, very true. We have a highly niche hobby and the chance of passing it down to an equally enthusiastic relative is tiny if not zero
If I think of my grandfather (born very early 1900s) buying a pocket watch in 1930 and the pocket watch stays in our family and makes its way down to my possession. I know I wouldn't wear it because 1. not my style, 2. probably would no longer work and th...
Good question Robert ! My mom left a small sized
Rolex to me because I am the only one with daughers out of her children. Which daughter gets it will evenutally be the ultimate question. No matter what, I hope the one who will get it will wear and enjoy the lineage. I will then need to leave another pie...
Thank you for your input Gordon
You certainly are passing your enthusiasm and knowledge along your bloodline! Well done. Best, Robert
First of all, Robert, congrats for having two lovely daughters. You are a lucky man!
Regarding the fate of our beloved collection, I also start to think of it recently. My two daughters seem not having much interest on horological collection. Not sure about my two nephews though. Guess I will be seriously thinking of trimming down my coll...