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Good choices, particularly the first.
To be honest, many of the dress watches in the 1980s to late-1990s were incredibly conservative. Perhaps indicative of a market that was lost and not yet found. The 80s and 90s watches that ventured outside this comfort zone are under-appreciated, perhaps being dismissed without further thought.
These are both extraordinary watches, particularly the first Star Wheel. Good luck with the bidding. If they remain under appreciated for long enough, perhaps I can dream of owning one in my lifetime.
The best of Audemars Piguet!
Some of us may forget that two decades ago before the Royal Oak became so popular, Audemars Piguet were making some astonishing dress watches. Fortunately for me, these watches now offer excellent value for money in the used market and I am considering pl...
The first piece is simply amazing- really my taste in several ways.
Thank you, Sham for posting this masterpiece
Thank you Christian!
I know it is a bit reckless of me to post these watches especially as I am planning to bid on them but these beauties need more appreciation even if it means my not being to obtain them! And yes, I am partial to the Star Wheel too which may go for the sam...
I dare say that you will be one of many purists who will outbid me! :-)
At least leave one for me if possible please
I have only bought at an auction once!
and that was a new piece. This is a bit of a gamble on my part I guess but I am expecting to have to send it for a service. Thanks for the good wishes. I shall need them!!
I'd be curious to know what it costs to service more complicated, older pieces like these
Did you have an estimate?
I have not enquired but
I will set aside USD5k for any service required which should cover it I hope.
In which case, I strongly suggest
that you go for this one!! It is number 10 out of 10. I love it but hey, I am sure you do too
You are most welcome!
These watches are almost like hidden gems in the world of Audemars Piguet!
That first one is extremely tasty
I find the star wheel complication much more interesting than a tourbillon for example This small package packs quite a punch! Best of luck getting it
Cheers Vinnie!
I shall put all my effort into obtaining this watch but I fear my best may not be good enough! One can only try
Great watches, I also spotted them
if I would bid on one of them, it would be the first one. However being only 33mm, that is a tad too smal for me. Perhaps the second one wears bigger seen the « dial »? Hope you get the one you want! Keep us posted, Dirk
Dirk, they are both the same size.
In fact there were a number of reiterations of the John Schaeffer minute repeater in the mid 90s and they all measured the same. Some were perpetual calendars, others were jump hours or plain minute repeaters but size wise no difference.
Definitely some great deals to be found on "vintage" APs
Some of the complications available for the asking prices are unreal.
I totally agree!
It just does not make sense when one can buy a used minute repeater from a top brand in remarkable conditon for less money than some of the independents are asking for finely finished three handed watches. Don't get me wrong - I love the Voutilainens, Rex...
Good choices, particularly the first.
To be honest, many of the dress watches in the 1980s to late-1990s were incredibly conservative. Perhaps indicative of a market that was lost and not yet found. The 80s and 90s watches that ventured outside this comfort zone are under-appreciated, perhaps...
Agreed!
Perhaps it is the size that is off putting, I am not quite sure but these John Schaeffers represent a bargain in today's world. I have no idea what they were priced when new but they seem undervalued in comparison with much out there.
Thank you Nico!
This seems to be the general consensus and I am swayed towards the Star Wheel too
The first one hands down!
Whoa, I'm incredibly surprised at the estimates for these. AP platinum minute repeaters under $40K??? Is that real?
I assume...
The estimates exclude buyers premium? So another 15-30%? Can someone more well versed in auctions confirm. I have never bid at auction... prefer private sales.
True, but estimates are just that...
Serves to draw people in to bid and help drive what really matters - what it sells for. Or am I being too cynical?
25% premium is the norm at these levels. I know the wandering hour version (#2 of 3) sold for about US$60k via Phillips HK a while back and the same watch for CHF32k back in 2010.
The skeleton version, watch #10, fetched US$79k almost in 2012 at Christie’s. Watch #8 sold for closer to US$40k just a year before at Sotheby’s. But something in my memory tells me I’ve seen these go for far less, I just can find the details right now. ...
Thanks Jay for the recollection.
I await in anticipation for the forthcoming auction. I have set my own limits - self discipline is key!
The AP minute repeaters
at the Geneva auctions that just ended last weekend were generally sold at about 20% above the estimates (inc buyers premium). The fact that the buyers premium is 25% indicates that the estimates were about right.
In my opinion, AP minute repeaters
are terribly undervalued at auctions. Maybe the smaller sized ones just do not command as high a price as the larger sized cases but hey, they are still minute repeaters and ideal for the smaller wristed folk like me.
I'll definitely have to keep an eye out for these in the future, I had no idea it was possible to get something like that within this price range.
Best of luck for the auction! Would love to see a review on one of these if you win
Unfortunately I did not bid for the star wheel
the reason being Christie's were kind enough to send me photos of the watch and the condition report confirmed that there was a ding on the case band at 9 o'clock which was off putting. For the record, both the above watches were sold for the same price -...
The buyer's premium is usually 25% at the price level
Having observed auctions, I have noticed that many estimates are exceeded especially at Philips auctions where the estimates seem on the lower course some lots remain unsold but the majority do sell.
Absolutely!
If you have been following the Geneva auctions, quite a few went for USD40k and under which included the 25% buyer's premium ie the hammer price was USD32k. Quite a bargain.
Absolutely Nico!I
As I was mentioning to jleno above, I have budgeted USD5k for a service and I hope that would be enough. I hope
Maybe that is why they are selling at relatively bargain prices
it is like buying a classic car and having it restored but I believe this AP is in better condition than a classic car! If not, I will have to rob a bank!
A question to an expert Nico
Can a ding on a watch case be repaired and be made to disappear? The star wheel above had a ding at the case band at 9 o'clock so I decided to refrain from bidding. The hammer price was HKD350,000 which was double its lower estimate and in excess of its h...
Good question Nico! :-)
Christie's sent this photo to me and to be honest, I never got around to asking them where the ding was!! Yes, I know, I know.....
I must make a confession
The final hammer price was above what I would have paid for it so I am not too disappointed Nico
I also participated the bid and dropped out when the hammer price went beyond my budget.
and just saw your post to chip in the discussion. I totally agree with you that Phllips is generally conservative in their estimate and Christie’s is more realistic. It’s just different auction tricks. If i remember correctly it’s already the second time ...
Oh wow! What a coincidence
or is this not a coincidence?!! In which case, I hope you will be bidding at the Christie's auction in New York where two more AP minute repeaters will be of offer. Again, both in platinum and again both John Schaeffers. I am just wondering if all these w...
I noticed them. But i think in NYC in live auction they may go beyond 45K
Moreover after losing the AP bid I spent my budget on other watches so I won’t participate this time
My budget was well exceeded months ago!
But with you not bidding for the APs in New York, I might even stand half a chance!!
Only 40k for one of the minute repeaters!
But I did not wake up for the auction - 6am Kuala Lumpur time!
A friend of mine called it
'The man in the iron mask'!! Limited to 3 pieces, that was going to sell for a high price!
I did not wake up in time Nico
The auction started at 6am Kuala Lumpur time and I am glad I slept through after last week's indulgence at Patek
Thanks Roland!
Your choice puts you in good company and I will bid as much as I can afford!
Roland, if you would like to meet up in KL
I will come to your hotel wherever you are!! I can't expect anyone to battle the KL traffic not even for an AP minute repeater!!