Independents

Sometimes we are faced with an interesting dilemma where either outcome is not such a bad thing. Every time I consider a chronograph and no matter which ones I do try be it the MontBlanc Heritage, the discontinued Patek Philippe 5170G or P , I find it har...  

Thank you for your feedback. In gold medal position as usual

Both watches are heavyweights. I would love to be able to afford both but being retired has its downside Thank you for your feedback.

However I think the Grönefeld suits your wrist much better. If I remember correctly the Grönefeld has a concave “belly” under it’s 39.5 mm- case is more elegant, lugs amazing. The 1815 is more sitting on your wrist not wrapping around it. And since you me... 

I say 'spot on' because my first reaction when trying the Lange tonight was that it was sitting on my wrist. I did not feel I was wearing the watch or that the watch was being a part of my wrist. The Gronefeld however (possibly due to the case shape and t... 

based on varying factors and generally through trial and error, we end up with a list of criteria that a watch has to satisfy. The Gronefeld ticks all the boxes, for me anyway.

I do expect many to favour the Lange here which is a monumental watch and I actually prefer it to the iconic Datograph.

It’s a difficult if not impossible dilemma. I to know the story behind the Grönefeld brothers and I to have been tempted (and still are tempted). What in the end made me hold back on the Grönefeld, (and I’m writing this with the utmost respect for the bro... 

Yes the continuity of an independent brand is always an issue many would feel uncomfortable with especially when a movement is as complex as the eight second remontoire. The Gronefeld brothers are younger than I am so from that perspective, I am reasonabl... 

No question.

Coming from Mr Lange himself, that is quite something!

But it’s really dependent on what your preferences. I’ll be happy with either, just for the pleasures of seeing those beautiful movements.

but I think the Gronefeld fits my wrist better. A perfect example of two watches with the same diameter but one has nicer lugs than the other which makes quite an important difference to the final decision.

Among the big brands they make the best, in my opinion. But they’re just a brand.

I tried the Gronefeld on at the SIHH in Geneva because it is not a watch sold in Malaysia. As for the Lange chronograph, that is so rare in this part of the world that it has been a two year wait since launch to see one.

I too tried the 1815, half “sitting” on my wrist. But the beauty of this legend is irresistible Looking at your collection, don’t you think you need to have a Chrono in the list? Difficult choice indeed.

Never buy a watch because of its irresistable legend - the watch has to suit your wrist not vice versa! I had made such costly mistakes in the past and ended up dissatisfied with the purchase because sooner or later more perfect watches would appear. Yes,...  

Thanks Sham for the advice. Appreciate it.

I have learned things the expensive way and would prefer if others do not not make the same mistakes that I used to!

It is simply a more interesting and artistic watch.

and have also decided on the Gronefeld

Great choice with the steel and silver dial version as well, assuming that's what you're going with. I think the cut out for the remontoire governor can be slightly obtrusive on the colored and Kari dials, but it blends in nicely on the silver dial. Looki... 

Yes the stainless steel and the silver dial would be my choice and as you correctly state, the governor at 9 o'clock then becomes less obvious or intrusive

that Bart Gronefeld emailed me yesterday to say that all the Remontoires have been allocated! :-( He did however suggest that I contact the authorised dealers and I have been calling all around the world. There are a few gold Remontoires around but not a ... 

Would you go with another version or pass on the Gronefeld altogether if you can't get steel?

that are still available. ...  

Another idea, go to OnlyWatch and try to win the piece unique!

and would actually prefer it to the piece unique at the Only Watch event. If there was one watch worth bidding for at the auction, my pick would be the Chronometre Contemporain!!

I like to think so. There have been many new watches released since the Gronefeld Remontoire but none in that price bracket has had the same impact on me as the Remontoire. The Chronometre Contemporain yes but it costs more money.

What pushes me that direction is many factors. It’s a better watch on the wrist for me (something you’ve notice too, it just sits better and therefore looks better and is more comfortable). It’s to me a more interesting watch, there are chronographs every... 

So you have placed an order for one too? Our watches might be identical due to our impeccable taste! Yes I agree, a Gronefeld is a very rare watch and a steel Remontoire even rarer

Maybe you shouldnt look at other options and if possible just pull the trigger . I know you wont regret your decision 😉 Btw the ALS 1815 is a true beauty too , so nothing wrong with that one as well

whereas you have one in your collection. This is one of the setbacks of retiring early my friend I have emailed Bart and Tim but they are away on their summer vacation. I think I need to at least leave a deposit to secure my watch before they are all sold... 

But please if i can do something for you when i am back in Holland just let me know . I guess they will be back arround the same time (aprox two weeks from now ) I know you need to leave a small deposit but then you know you will get one in a year or so .... 

The brothers will be back on 16 August so I hope to hear from them shortly after. And I shall definitely visit them when I collect my watch and yes, I will be humbled if you are able to follow me there. It would make the experience extra special and memor... 

Please let me know and we will make it a exciting and very special day then 🙏🏻🤗. I hope you will get good news in a few weeks 😉.

in itself would be such a thrill. To do so with you next to me would be something to savior! We must take some special photos to commemorate experience!

was one of the wisest things I have done in years

Like they say ,, buy the seller ,, . I am so glad to be part of the watch community .its not all about the watches also about the people you meet 🙏🏻. The Moser will have a very special place in my collection , not because its such a great watch and a grai... 

Many a time, I repeat the Moser 'transaction' at the airport to people I meet and they must think I am either very foolish or very trusting (probably both). The meeting was so pleasant that I never did count the money that you had given me even after retu... 

The feeling is likewise and i hope our friendship will last forever wherever we stay around the world . Thats the most importend part of our ,,crazy hobby ,, imho . The great people we meet and the friendship we gain from that 🙏🏻🙏🏻

When entering this forum, I had not expected to make friends but amazingly our passion for watches has overcome the cultural and geographical barriers. I seem to be making good friends at watch events because of our common interests and little would one b... 

I am glad to see that you still consider great options. Obviously both are very beautiful ones but hardly comparable. One thing I can tell you is that I once had a Datograph ALS that I had to let go because of the size not fitting my small wrist (and your... 

The Gronefeld Remontoire is one of those watches that one reads so many wonderful things about but that hardly does the watch justice because when one has a chance to wear it and get lost in the movement, words cannot describe the experience. It is just t... 

...even if presently I am considering another option also in a similar price range from another Indy...

so many wonderful offerings and I am not sure if it is a good thing or bad thing to have a budget. Yes it would be nice to buy everything we like but I personally feel this financial constraint allows us to appreciate more what we finally end up buying.

As it is, both wear big on your wrist to be honest (I understand and appreciate why you like smaller sized watches But if you must, the 1815 would mitigate the size issue better due to the dial color. And if you don't care about the size, then you can't g... 

Both watches at 39.5mm are about the maximum size I can wear. Saying that, the lugs on the Gronefeld curved better and are shorter which does help. As you can see from the photos before, I have a small wrist! 37.3mm has seldom looked larger! 34.6mm looks ...  

I know how it is to be retired ;-) By the way, 35 seems to be the sweet spot for you. Although that 37mm GS doesn't seem too bad

but unfortunately in our passion where the best watches are between 38mm and 42mm, it would be difficult to focus on just 35mm watches. And I would shy away from vintage watches in general due to the reliability and accuracy issues which are important to ... 

the Gronenfeld. It has a beautiful dial which you won't get bored and it has the remontoir, which is pretty rare. The 1815 chronograph is just another iteration of the legendary Datograph. I have not tried the Gronenfeld on the wrist but I know that the 1... 

Yes, I have decided on the Gronefeld and await the brothers to return from their summer vacation next week so that I can place my order and deposit. The lugs on the Gronefeld make it a more comfortable watch to wear for the smaller wristed folk like you a... 

The movement on the Remontaire edge out slightly, if only because it is so unique, and it's finished on SS which is difficult. I will get both if I will you but if force to choose, the remontaire. You can always get an 1815 chronograph later down the road... 

I agree with you that the Remontoire is the one to have at present due to its limited supply. In fact there are fewer than a handful of steel Remontoires remaining and they are all in the USA. Personally, I know of no movement more attractive looking that... 

Being an owner of both (albeit the original datograph rather than the 1815 chronograph) and living with them for a few years already, I'd say it'd be nearly impossible to make a wrong choice. However, on the information you have on the remontoire, I belie... 

Yes Bart Gronefeld has confirmed that there are more than 25 steel pieces in the market especially as the Remontoire shares the same case as the Principa. In addition, there were 12 Hodinkee Remontoire made in steel. I am still partial to the Remontoire a...  

Sorry for the late reply, haven't check back to the site for a couple of days. Have seen both dials (but not this actual configuration), they are gorgeous.... Some of my friends already had this dilemma before and it's really just a matter of preference (... 

I shall be ordering the watch from one of the few authorised dealers because according to Bart Gronefeld, all 188 of the Remontoire movements have now been allocated to owners and ADs. Yes the blue fish scale guilloche dial would normally cost a lot more ... 

Good luck and keep us posted on your decision!

You guys will be the first to know