Comments:
Roger Smith
I’m considering placing my name on the list for one of Rogers’ watches, specifically for the series 2.
The wait now is many years. And the price is very significant, but these aren’t getting cheaper.
I’d like to canvas the group and hear some opinions. I get the sense that this is somewhat of a polarizing watchmaker. But the more I read, the harder it is for me to deny its significance.
A Smith watch is 'the one that got away' for me...
...but only because, even thought they were not too expensive in the early days, I was also really poor back then.
And now they are just too much money for me. My only nitpick is they seem far too thick for what I consider a dress watch.
If you love it and can afford it, go crazy : )
Yes, they are thick watches
But I like thicker watches. They feel more permanent and three-dimensional. So that is not one of my concerns.
It’s really a sh*t load of money……….
If money isn’t a concern I say go for it. But I can think of several ways to that spend that sum.
Best
Gatsby
Best
Gatsby
Yes, it really is
However, the direct price from the workshop is still significantly lower than preowned secondary prices
So this is what I truly think
I would analyze the question as such:
1. Firstly, where does the RWS fit in the collection ? Is this the end ?
2. Secondly. What other high-end pieces are you chasing ? In comparison to the RWS, which would you rather have to maximize your own utility and happiness?
3. Thirdly. Think about what else you can do with all that dough !!
Best
Gatsby
P.S. I’m inclined not to buy. It is just way too much money…
1. Firstly, where does the RWS fit in the collection ? Is this the end ?
2. Secondly. What other high-end pieces are you chasing ? In comparison to the RWS, which would you rather have to maximize your own utility and happiness?
3. Thirdly. Think about what else you can do with all that dough !!
Best
Gatsby
P.S. I’m inclined not to buy. It is just way too much money…
It’s a lot of money
And requires considered thought. It would knock me out of the game for five years
If you can put your name on the list i would definitely do it my friend .
To have a RwS in your collection is a dream come true. Such a amazing grail and superb masterpiece
If it calls out to be bought...
Then do it. As was pointed out, there are other watches to he had for that amount.
Value a Smith watch based on its own merits, not because of Smith's connection to Daniels -- that's my opinion.
Personally, I think I would get more satisfaction from looking at a Daniels in a museum than from owning a Smith.
That’s the argument I hear most often and one that I take to heart
Would Smith command as much attention without his association to Daniels? Probably not. But is that association significant enough to command as much respect and attention as he is currently?
All watchmakers learn their craft from someone. It's absolutely appropriate to consider the teacher when evaluating the maker. As such, if the teacher is/was a top-tier watchmaker...
...then the student, assuming they learned well, has the potential of being equal to their teacher, at least technically. In this case, although I'd prefer a Daniels over a Smith purely from a historical standpoint, I don't believe it diminishes the value of the Smith in any way. But it's not like I'll ever own either, so...
I've heard people discussing how many generations a pianist was removed . . .
. . . from studying under Franz Liszt. Earl Wild was only two generations removed. I'm pretty sure there's no one left who's only two generations removed. But there's still reverence for Liszt's lineage.
If I were a watchmaker, I'd be honored to be Smith's understudy.
Art
But Daniels is a part of the Roger Smith story. And dare I say, vice versa. And it’s a cool relationship too. Not sure there’s a mentor mentee story like that of Daniels-Smith..
So why deny that from the equation?
Even if I had the money for something like a Greubel Forsey, I’d go Roger Smith. The heart wants what the heart wants.
Even if I had the money for something like a Greubel Forsey, I’d go Roger Smith. The heart wants what the heart wants.
The only person I know who's had one told me he sold it because it was 'a bit too hand-made'. Make of that what you will.
Did you get a sense he was remarking on the functioning of the watch?
Or just that a myriad of "flaws" appeared when looking via a loupe or decent set of eyes?
Hello Cosomopak
I recently bought a RWS series 2 used and have ordered a series 4 from Mr. Smith so I am a fan. Opposite most decisions in my life, value has less to do with my passion for RWS than the unique experience of owning something really, really special and a part of watch history. It took me 13 years of buying and collecting watches maybe 200 watches+ to get to this point, along with great advice and mentoring from some good friends so I have went from Panerai, Rolex and other nice brands to almost exclusively Independent watchmakers and it is so special in comparison. Really another world…IMHO RWS is at the top of that list.
The naysayers on this thread are not the arbiters of watchmaking history and they may just be jealous they don’t own, can’t afford a or do not want to go through the waiting period needed to get a RWS (no offense intended to anyone), So IMHO do not listen to them! “Follow your heart” is often used on this forum and I usually scoff at that phrase because, for me, the heart is just a tool to help guide our brains to the best decision, but in this case I have used both. I LOVE my RWS, which is very close to the one you posted, but I consider myself a pretty astute businessman also after 47 years of running a very successful business and personally I don’t see anything wrong with the value proposition of you ordering a RWS. Of course unforeseen things can happen, Smith dies etc so there is some risk but I believe it is still a 5000 pound deposit so if you are willing to risk that why not order one if your heart agrees?
FYI, I have had a lot of contact with Carolyn Smith and what a joy she is to deal with, her and Mr. Smith are very dedicated and fair peopleI that do not take short cuts. I’ve also sent in my series 2 for service, didn’t need to just wanted to, and an armored car shows up at my home to pick up the watch shipping it to the Isle of Man quickly and securely, no 2 year wait on service I should have the watch back in 90 days or less.
Please let us know how your decision works out…JIm
Thank you, Jim.
I really appreciate your insights. Your series 2 is stunning, and so close to the one that I would want for myself
Thanks Jim, it's nice to have your perspective, however,
I don't think it's appropriate to dismiss the views of members of our community as "jealousy" simply because they are different than your own. That's not respectful, nor does it really fit anyone's post here, unless you'd care to be more specific. I think it has a dampening effect on our conversation, so I'd like to ask that you be careful in using it, particularly when you have so many other, more positive things to contribute.
Remember: It's okay for people to not like something you like! Feel free to remind me of the same sometime if I forget!
Remember: It's okay for people to not like something you like! Feel free to remind me of the same sometime if I forget!
HI Spangles thanks for your comments, dully noted
I may have bee too strong when I said “Jealously” however I also wrote “no offense intended to anyone”. I certainly was not being accusatory to anyone but stating something I believe is part of life even if we don’t like to admit it…Hopefully the author of the post took my comments as they were intended. Enjoy your week…Jim
I’m clueless so take it with a grain of salt 😅
The look of RWS just doesn’t appeal to me…sorry I know there is a lot of exquisite work inside and some will say “only the owner know” or “if you know, you know”. I see Breguet having similar looks and textures.
I think if you’re looking for the next PD, maybe this is the one for you.
I’m just still worry about the continuity of independent brand and what happens if no worthy disciples took over.
It is very appealing to have a “living” artist or watchmaker but to me, this is not like a piece or Painting 🖼 by Picasso or Van Gogh where it stays genuine for hundreds of years. A watch needs to be serviced and taken parts to replace etc.
We can say the same for current brands like PP, Breguet, VC or Lange etc….but I just have more confidence in the bigger brands.
This is just me being conservative but I don’t feel the watch to begin with.
Totally fair opinion.
The fear that a watch won’t be able to be serviced if a brand or watchmaker ceases to exist, however, is a fear that I don’t share, although it is commonly cited. Mechanical watches are only increasing in popularity, and there will always be someone capable of servicing anything (at least in my lifetime). And a faulty part can always be CNCed or likely 3D printed in the very near future.
Yes it can be fixed, no doubt…
But by who would you feel comfortable with handling your RWS to…PD, GF, RG, KV, FPJ personally or any watchmaker?
Very good conundrum to consider hypothetically
But I can guarantee you that there are skilled artisans who will be available to service these pieces if need be for the right price
I'd only pass if there was another watch I could think of enjoying more.
That being said, I'm sure a Series 2 will always be considered one of the pinnacle time-only watches. As you mentioned, I don't see acquiring one ever getting any easier. My vote is to get on the list!
I've certainly pondered
the ultimate current independent expression for a time-only watch. For me, it comes down to KV and/or RS.
Definitely order it!
But, before doing so, consider the width of the watch in terms of wearability. It's not going under a shirt sleeve! Maybe wear around a modern Omega chrono to practice! Clearly, not a problem unless it's not well considered and then it may be a problem. I have my thick watches and now find thin is in when it comes to the stealth wearability I've come to favor.
As for servicing, I know an independent watchmaker who can service an RWS in NYC, plus Charles Frodsham in the UK is fully and easily up to the task, so Roger has a deep bench of back-ups, as it were.
As for servicing, I know an independent watchmaker who can service an RWS in NYC, plus Charles Frodsham in the UK is fully and easily up to the task, so Roger has a deep bench of back-ups, as it were.