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well, it does not mean superior in value but superior in effort (of the manufacturer)
I am not a fan of reworked movements for a single brand.
Not a fan in regards paying so much for that watch.
An in-house movement AND more importantly an in-house hairspring is all what watch collecting is about ... at a certain level.
Patek chrono battle: 5970G vs. 5170P
What is your preference among these two, that are now fairly close in price? Personally, I was very close to deciding to go for a 5170P to accompany my 5960a. I have ruled out Lange, and for Patek I have ruled out 5905 and 5270 due to size. But now I have...
Sorry, they are not fairly close in price.
For a good 5970G you will have to pay 40 to 50% more than for a new 5170P. Best, Volker
5970G all the way.
It’s almost perfect. The decision between white and blue dial is difficult though; I think I have a slight preference for the blue (no chin please 😉).
You must be talking about 5270 here Volker, not 5970?
Ether way, I'm with you on the chin!! Thomas
5170P for me, as
I like better this watch after seing it twice and put on my wrist ;-)) The fact that 5170P has a IN HOUSE calibre as 5960s Also cherry on the cake: much more limited Edition than 5970s But 5970G is an iconic PC: another choice. Both are Great, Good choice...
fine....
.....but there should be no implication that just because something has an in-house movemment that it is in some way "superior". My point is that the 2499 is viewed as possibly one of the most desirable watches ever made by Patek Philippe ... and it doesn...
well, it does not mean superior in value but superior in effort (of the manufacturer)
I am not a fan of reworked movements for a single brand. Not a fan in regards paying so much for that watch. An in-house movement AND more importantly an in-house hairspring is all what watch collecting is about ... at a certain level.
I think....
.... that is too simplistic an assessment for me. Sometimes, the sum of the parts just do not exceed the whole. We all differ.
Very well said Joe,...
... its not about the latest innovative material of hairspring that improved 1/2 sec per month the accuracy, or the latest tools that do this or that. It's about the magic, the work of those hands that can do things that no machine can replicate not in 10...
👍
.... and for collectors it’s obviously not decisive. Compare the prices of 5070 vs. 5170 and 5970 vs. 5270. You have to pay for used 5070s much more than for new 5170s, and the same goes for the PCCs mentioned.
I guessed you would chime in Patrickh!!
Your descriptions of the 5170P has helped my process a lot. I think it will be a very special reference, and I think they will be sought after.
5170P should be seen in real and look on your wrist. All photos are macro sized and not realistic.
Diamond baguettes are very refined and add a special light on the blue/black graduated dial. A "KILLER" IMHO. I have not the budget to get one unfortunately. Best, Patrickh
"process a lot " sounds like beating on the futur...
... if you want the "safer" bet, its the 5970G. Or the 5070P... Even though you should go for the 5170P for the simple reason that you sound like you are loving it
You are asking for a straight opinion....
.....and there is no choice between the two for me. I just wouldn't buy a watch with diamonds on the dial. But, if you are good with the diamonds, then the choice becomes harder. I would still go 5970 simply because it is a much more complicated watch and...
But you own a 5170G, right?
And still you would recommend the 5970? That's a strong input! Thomas
Yes, even the G.
Granted, I had another member's 5970P on, but it was really the size and general proportions of the watch that got me, not the colors. The dial layout, everything just clicked for me. I did try the G on not too long ago, and the same feeling returned.
I’m far to be a Patek specialist so I’ll just give you my personal feeling between these two watches from a pure aesthetic point of view
The dial of the 5970P is too busy for me due to the addition of the PC data of course. The dial of the 5170P breathes more despite is dark blue dial. More specifically, this dark blue dial is truly beautiful and I’m absolutely not annoyed by the diamond i...
Its a 5970G by the way.....
......5970P is very different. I think you put it well..... ultimately it is a matter of taste...let your heart do the talking.
When Patek offers four different metal combinations for one model (5110 for instance), it’s already a puzzle to opt for only one and not the four
So when you have to choose between two references, it becomes a true torture. But yes, your heart can help you in your decision-making process. Probably more than your brain. Best wishes Alkiro
Good input, Alkiro
Viewed next to each other, the 5170P is the best match with the 5960a. I have learned though the 5960a ownership that having a dial that pays with light is essential to me. It is almost like having many variants of there same watch! I'm sure the 5170P doe...
I’m sure you’ll find here all the advices you could dream about 😊
Whatever will be your decision, that will be the right one. Keep us informed 😉 Best wishes Alkiro
It is indeed quite a difficult choice
and as such, you'll have very different and interesting inputs to help your decision making process. Keep in mind that we all represent a specific part of the watch population and that it is more about guiding you through your own process First, as it see...
Hi Thomas!
Firstly, I want to say how fortunate you are to be in such a predicament. As much I like the 5170P, you are comparing a chronograph with a perpetual calendar chronograph so it is almost an unfair fight. It is probably best to base your decision on practic...
5270 does not adhere to Shams law
I'm very determined to comply to it - I'm not even joking!! Thomas
I love the 5270R
and for a long time it was my ultimate watch. Finally my AD told me honestly that she felt it was too large for me. I shall be forever indebted to her for this unusual gesture. And Thomas, you complying to Sham's 'law' is most flattering but it really dep...
Take the 5170 P: it is unique in design and will mostlikely not appaer as such again
The 5970 is mundane looking compared to the daring, brave and quirky 5170 P. The 5270 looks nearly identical to the 5960 ( for a layman identical!). Also the movement of the 5170 is faaaar, far more advanced and interesting than of the 5970. The only reas...
5170P for me, any day of the week
A stunning dial, in-house chrono, and a stunning dial ...
5170p
Just my preference, so nice and good use of negative space versus the other. The diamond markers are perfect. I always end up thinking I would first choose a VC Cornes de Vache, so perhaps my take is best discarded!
The VC is the best looking chrono ever
They just did not get the pricing right in my opinion. The steel one would be to die for if it did not say Hodinkee on the back.
the answer is so easy for me 5970 add to this the former ref 5004 and you have the two best patek chronos ever made, they both feature the ch 27-70q which is based on the lemania 2320 but
greatly and so well reworked , that I find better than Patek's new inhouse movement. And the lemania 2320 is still used by Breguet and Vacheron
Hi Thomas. 5170p all day long...
Between these two if your are thinking about investment criteria which I guess you are as most do here. If you are looking for a truly great watch which you can enjoy wearing with some great complications (which is why you buy a patek ) then go for the 52...
Sorry Pretty boy confused me mixing up his references.
Same goes for 5170p v 5970g just for the record. M.
Or better still: the salmon!
I got confused about your disclaimer, though. 5170P for investment, and 5970 for the joy of it, or did you mean "5970 all day long"?
No I did mean 5170p between the 2 Thomas suggested
5970g standard dial or a 5170p. Purely based on future availability and value. However I think any 5970 is infinitely better looking. M.
Don't do what others suggest but make your own decision!
For me it would be simple: 5170P - it has a fantastic movement - it has a very sober case, kind of understated - the dial is great - I do not believe this reference is long lasting Furthermore, I do not really in the combination of QP and chronograph espe...
I will certainly not discard your advice!
I remember well your advice regarding manual pcc's when I asked about 5270. I don't aspire to owning more than a handful of watches, but I do see your point. Thanks for strong arguments regarding the 5170P!! Thomas
I find this a very interesting question, but for a slightly different reason (see below). Of the two you query, however, I'm in the camp of 5170. I love the blue dial and, as I've written before, believe the diamond markers are a beautiful addition.
This coming from someone who too would have never bought a watch with visible diamonds (platinum 6 o'clock marker excluded). In the flesh I really believe they take the piece to another level aesthetically. Ditto on the 40th Nautili My query for the OP an...
Good advice!
I have not considered split chronographs because it is an entirely different ballgame price-wise. 5004 and 5204 are grails, no doubt. As are 5372 and 5370
That's a very good input
It is always interesting to have other propositions when one is making a tour of what he might consider. The 5204 that I reviewed on the forup in R is a great reference and the answers I read to the post, in addition to 1 or 2 pictures from ownes we had r...
Agree!
Also I was surprised to see that the 5204 was only 40mm. I would have thought it was way bigger. Talking about split chronographs, Mark: is there any chance that the 5370 will come out in other colors (white) out is this typically a one-off thing from Pat...
Indeed, 40mm for the 5204R
You can have a look at it here if interested: www.watchprosite.com Well the 5370P started from a surprising proposition and led to this model inspired from an old Patek model. We could think that, because of its unusual case design, it could have ...
Both stunning in their own right..
Comparing apples and oranges. The 5170 is a chronograph Patek has long needed and successfully captures several facets of Patek's history in my opinion. A pure, Patek designed chronograph movement, will carve its own story in history. Although this will b...
Thanks for your very nuanced advice.
Very much appreciated!! My AD has promised me that I will get a 5170P allocated if I want one. It might be the only one they get, so that is tempting in its own right. But that case.. Is it "sober" or is it "boring"? I think many the dial compensates anyh...
there are 62 "5970s" sellers waiting for a buyer
on C.....24 today. You could find one at YOUR price. Buyer is now driving the market. Think about it, if you will want to sell it in the future. My 2 cents, Between 5170P and 5970G: choose which one makes you HAPPIER. That is the Best rule. Patrickh
62 sellers of 5970, eh?
And 123 sellers of 5170. I do agree with one thing that you said- go with what makes you happiest.
Funny you say that....
So many watches in Chr24 are actually never there when you ask. Just dealers fishing.
Been there, seen that.
It's especially true with new references. The older ones are more "true". Luckily I'm not dealing in that market anymore. I'm just happy with the current + future references. Best, Kari
I think the price difference between the two is no not big
As you say, timing could be good!
The number of sellers on xxxxxx24 doesn't equal number of watches for sale. Many of these "sellers" are simply brokers advertising a timepiece they believe they can source (though some may not even be that honest)
A bit like the loose diamond trade, wherein we can locate the exact same stone advertised by multiple different, independent dealers simultaneously
Tough call and there is no right or wrong here, just 2 options that address 2 different tastes...
actually so different that it is almost surprising to find them together on the same starting grid... All comments mentioned are correct even if bringing to contradictory conclusions because each conclusion is in adequation with the one who writes. Actual...
Thanks Mike!
I will make an attempt to try both. It will require some traveling to make that happen though! I agree that they are very very different- to the extent that "both" is probably the best option. I think it would make a nice three watch collection (I threw t...
I understand it might not be the easiest thing to do to try them both and it might involve some travelling but...
...I believe such a watch cannot be bought based on photographs only or comments from Purists friends. Such a watch (whether 5970 or 5170) must be tried in the metal to check how comfortable it feels on your wrist, how you like the design in real life, an...
Trying out and feeling watches in metal is prerogative
But you can also make a case for "arranged marriages". I bought a 1815 chrono before ever seeing one in the flesh based on advice and descriptions here at the forum. It was not love at first sight and I would not have bought it if it was not for this foru...
I had an 1815 chrono
which I tried on but I still sold it after 3 weeks - it was way too heavy - something I could only conclude after the wearing the watch for a prolonged period, something that cannot be done in a shop
I did not know you had had that one too my friend!
Me too I made the same experience. I had however tried it in the metal shortly (at the occasion of a lunch with FX who owns that 1815 chrono) and concluded (wrongly) that the watch was less thick enough and less heavy (vs the Datograph thet I admire but w...
But I definitely agree with Mike H
seek advice from all us 'experts' but you should really try on something of this value to limit the risk of buying an unsuitable watch. You were lucky with the 1815 chrono as it is a lovable piece with a sublime movement and you have obviously a stronger ...
Yep I agree, in conclusion I would say...
"Don't push your luck !" for such an expensive watch advice and experience from friends and experts is not enough. Only TOU can judge when you have it on your wrist... My 2 cents
Many with far superior knowledge than I have spoken, but here is my two cents.
I'm not as versed with all the nuances of each, but the 5970 "feels" better to me. Have always loved the month and day display. The business of the dial is diminished with the lighter colored dials.
no question about it
The 5970G is much more of a major collector's item than the 5170P. Eric
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