Patek Philippe

I just picked up Large 1917 Gondola and the dial seems to me in very good condition. How can you tell if the dial is refinished. I am in the process of ordering the Patek Archive. Will it tell on the Archive? What should I look for?...  

that you have found a very nice rectangular PP from the 20´s. Similar pieces can be found in the PP literature. Do you think it is a re-dial, just because of the good condition? If you have more pictures to share, please keep them coming. Oliver

The dial is in very good condition. Almost to good. I am not an expert but the dial looks to be enamial. The patek lettering on the face also look to be have nice gloss like the rest of the watch/ I am assuming it is patek but I am concerned it is a a lat... 

of the archive will not indicate if the dial ever has been changed. It will state the way the watch left the factory. Nice wtach though. Best regards, Dirk

Having Geneva instead of Genève seems wrong to me. Cheers Stan

Condition aside, I strongly suspect that this is a redial. The font appears inconsistent with other examples I've seen from this era and the tracks on the dial periphery are not symmetrically spaced (esp. top right corner). Details unlikely to be overlook... 

I noticed the same thing on the spacing but every watch from this era I could find online spaced the numbers the same way. The 4 offset from the 8 and also the 2 offset from the 10. Here are a more internal shots of the movement and case. i also have a pi...  

So that aspect looks ok. I did a quick search and found at least one other example from the same period with Geneva on the dial. This was auctioned by a big auction house. Br, Dirk ...  

The case is 26 mm x 43 mm. Is that the biggest case or can the be larger? Here is a picture of the case. I belief the case looks right but the dial is my concern. It the crown a replacement? ...  

Case size is not the largest. In fact, the chronometer rectangular cases can be seen at 50mm in length and 28mm in width. The crown looks to be original in my opinion.

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congratulations on a marvellous piece. I only wish they (-> the industry !) would make such a movement again in a basic watch. But i guess that with today's watchmaker wages this is prohibitory. Cheers, Magnus

Difficult to comment from the small pics. I have a rule of thumb, first impressions are often right. If it looks too clean, neat and new, it often is. Obviously this can be wrong but most times it works Julian

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I'm sorry....but for me the clincher is the script.... PATEK PHILIPPE & Co GENEVA SWITZERLAND The letters are poorly done and IMO....definitely not the quality that PP would ever allow from their factory....and if you compare the quality to that of th... 

It is hard to tell. I did more research on the las picture and found it was completly refinished. Who knows. I do know it was owned by a 1915 movie director and writer(name on the back). It was then purchased from a high end shop in newport 8 years ago by... 

In my opinion the dial looks to be refinished. It is not generally seen that a dial made for a watch circa 1917 would have "Swiss" printed at the 6 position. I believe that this was reserved for watches made after the 1950's. At the very least the dial is... 

Rolex Doc has written a thorough analysis that IMHO seems to hit the mark. I would only add one other possibility, however unlikely, namely that even if "Swiss" might not have been printed on an original 1917dial, if the replacement dial was made many yea...