Independents

Bill
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Is Hermès Truly Independent? A Watchmaking Case That Might Surprise You.

This post was sparked by something subtle but thought-provoking:

Member Modernahab recently shared a photo of his Hermès Arceau Le Temps Voyageur —but instead of posting it in Horological Meandering , he chose the Independents forum.

That small decision got me thinking: Is Hermès actually an independent watchmaker? Or are they a fashion house with serious horological ambitions, but not quite independent in the traditional sense?

At first glance, Hermès might seem like a “fashion brand making watches.” But the reality is much more nuanced—and recently, more precarious.

The Manufacturing Reality (with a caveat)

Hermès has spent the past two decades strategically investing in real horological capability:

• Vaucher Manufacture Fleurier – Hermès holds a 25% minority stake , while the Sandoz Family Foundation owns the remaining 75%. This partnership has enabled Hermès to co-develop proprietary calibres like the H1837 and H1912. But they don’t control it.

• Natéber – Acquired dial maker specializing in métiers d’art such as guillochage and grand feu enamel.

• Joseph Erard Holding – Hermès owns 32% of this case manufacturer.

• Les Ateliers d’Hermès Horloger – Their integrated manufacture in Le Noirmont handles final assembly and testing.

On the surface, this is serious vertical integration. Far more than other fashion brands, and on par with respected maisons.

But here’s the complication:

Hermès is not in full control of its movement supply. The Sandoz Foundation is actively looking to sell Vaucher . If it ends up in the hands of LVMH , Richemont , or Swatch Group , Hermès could lose privileged access to movements they helped develop.

Reportedly, Hermès has tried multiple times to acquire Vaucher outright , but their bids have been rejected. (Source: Swisswatches Magazine)

That’s an existential risk to the “independent” narrative.

The Wider Picture: Who Else Uses Vaucher?

While Hermès has played a key role in developing movements, they’re not Vaucher’s biggest client . That title goes to Audemars Piguet.  Vaucher, assisting in the production of between 50,000 and 60,000 movements per year across all its clients which includes components . Other clients include Richard Mille , Corum , Speake-Marin , and Baume & Mercier .

It’s also important to note that Vaucher isn’t alone—it’s part of the Sandoz “Pôle Horloger” , which includes:

• Atokalpa – Escapements and balance springs (rare capabilities)

• Elwin – Micro-components

• Quadrance et Habillage – Dials

• Les Artisans Boîtiers – Case making

If the entire pole is sold, a significant part of Swiss high-end watchmaking supply could be reshuffled—and Hermès could be left exposed.

Creative Vision: Still Legit

Despite this structural vulnerability, Hermès watches are creatively autonomous . The Arceau Le Temps Voyageur , Arceau Squelette , and even the divisive H08 all reflect a brand willing to take risks, rather than follow trends. These aren’t accessories—they’re fully realized horological statements.

So Where Does That Leave Us?

Is Hermès independent?

• If we define it by manufacturing depth and creative control , they come impressively close.

• But if ownership and supply-chain security are part of the equation, their independence is far more fragile than it appears.

They don’t answer to a watch group—but they also don’t fully control the heart of their watches.

My Take?

Hermès has done more than almost any non-watchmaker to earn horological credibility. They think, design, and assemble like an independent. But until they secure their own full movement-making capability, their status sits somewhere between “independent” and “strategically entangled.”

Curious to hear what others think:

• How should we define independence in 2025?

• Does a 25% stake and creative autonomy suffice?

• Or is true independence only possible when you own the supply chain?

• some data souced from -  swisswatches-magazine.com and https://swisswatches-magazine.com/first-to-the-post-what-next-as-investors-circle-vaucher-manufacture-fleurier/