Horological Meandering

ThomasM
[PuristS]
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nein nein nein nein nein

With few exceptions (Haldimann, Voutilainen among them; in direct knowledge, Paul Gerber and Svend Andersen too but I've heard other stories...) many of the independents could care less about the client, they blow smoke up your skirt because they think you can help feed their family for the next 5 years.

And for those who think "hey, they treat me like royalty! I don't know what you are talking about, TM" just give it a few years and stop looking like a meal ticket; then see how respectul and kind and generous with their time and knowledge they are.

But S, several of your statements are guilty of some very common (too common) misconceptions.

To wit -

"True or better yet why don't I stop buying their watches altogether and buy from a firm that has excellent after sales service?"

You assume that any one customer actually makes a difference, or that the seller cares about any one customer. In most cases, they don't.

I've stopped buying from a brand many times. I doubt very much they noticed, or if they did, even cared.

Panerai. VC. even Dufour (we're friends again, I really try not to permanently burn bridges unless the other party is REALLY REALLY an asshole...and of course, Philippe is not.)

"companies need to realize that we won't take this anymore unless they get their act together."

"practices need to be brought to the fore so that buyers can understand what they have to put up with once they buy that "sexy" looking watch and the companies need to realize that we won't take this anymore unless they get their act together."

But S, the consumers themselves are to blame as well. (and no, I am not blaming the victim, but am pointing out when the 'innocent'  victim is not so innocent)

A friend had his Lamborghini serviced; was billed and paid $4000 for a car that basically had nothing wrong with it.

He drives it 500 miles a year. He didn't discover what a crappy job was done (including billing for a cylinder low compression problem that was pure made up bullshit) until well after any reasonable period of time to make a claim.

Know any watch buyers who sound like this?

And then there are the people who have 1 (or 2 or 5 experiences) and then draw gospel like conclusions - "Wow! I got good service 1 (2, 5) times, they are perfect!"

And worse, "I got 2 crappy service experiences, these guys are CRAP!"

Uh, huh.

I look, see, hear, and actively seek out first person experiences, TEMPERED and brought into focus by personal experience (which makes me different than "professional" polling companies like Harris, JD Powers, or any of the myriad new self-proclaimed consultants to or experts in the luxury goods industry...not better, just different...)

And I always leave plenty of room for error or misinterpretation or sample space errors in my conclusions, when I actually try to draw any.

Even john davis (ei8htohms) can (rightfully) ask me if my data space might have been corrupted by "user error"...

Other sites and entities feel some purpose is served to have self-reported experiences; the reader "can make up their own mind."

I see the wisdom of such ideas (Ebay is probably the biggest user of such "feedback") but I personally feel the downsides are greater than the upsides.

"alot of times the attitude is that if he/she is rich enough to buy this watch then they are rich enough to get screwed, the more you screw them the better it is, not limited to watches, also seen this with ADs for exotic cars as well. "

This is, alas, too true, and unfortunately, "true" in more than just the pragmatic "this is reality" sense; also in more abstract ways (I've been brooding over various variations of this topic for the last several days; see BL and Auto and maybe even travel and WFED forum in coming days and weeks and months.)

"Whats the incentive to care? I mean when they sell you a watch at an AD or Manufacture owned Boutique the salespersons make a commission but whats the financial incentive to care? As far as I know nothing. That can't bode well for us."

S, I am very very familiar, both personally, academically, and professionally with the ongoing battle, both philosophical and empirically based between the "commission based" vs "flat salary based" schools, believe me when I write this - there are COMPELLING reasons for both, and more than one being abstractly more "right" or "effective" than the other, is that the management choice must be RIGHT and APPROPRIATE for the organization - the management, and the employees.

Paying me based on commission, for example, might motivate me a little. Pay me based upon pride of work and I'll work day and night for you.

A little perhaps confusing example - I was driving by a parking lot which had a perfect, unobstructed view of the Pacific and an anchored yacht in the distance. I pulled in, asked the attendant if I could just pull down into the 3/4 empty lot and take a few pictures. 10, 15 min max, without paying the parking fee.

Brusquely, he waved me in, mumbling "15 min..."

As I was taking pictures, people kept coming up to talk to me; quickly it bacame 30 minutes, then 45 minutes.

I noticed the attendant start walking towards me, then turned around to go back to his attendants chair.

That reminded me to hurry up and finish, even though there were plenty of spaces left (it was now about 5/8 empty)

As I as finishing up, someone with a potentially nasty dog came up to me and told me I had to leave RIGHT NOW. Since you didn't pay, you have to leave RIGHT NOW.

Fair enough; I was finishing up anyway, and in fairness, I was there longer than I said I would be (though again, I kept getting interrupted by people wanting to talk, and I didn't want to be a jerk. Not the parking lots problem, I realize...) still, a dog, what, to threaten me? and the tone...very very unpleasant (I had stronger words in mind)

So as I was getting ready to drive away (Mr. Dogman planted himself in front of me, watching my every move) I thought, you know, the guy was cool to let me in, it wasn't his problem I kept getting interrupted in my photo taking, I was there longer than I said I would be. So I wanted to go over and say, hey, thanks, and give him the $4 for the parking and explain I wasn't a liar, I just kept getting interrupted by strangers.

Mr. MeanDogMan would not leave me alone and kept insisting, in increasingly nasty tones. you have to leave. NOW.

The body language was definitely hostile.

F' him.

My point - I'm driven more by my sense of "right and wrong" than by being able to "get away" with the $4.

"very true the Service Apres-Vente (customer service) people and technicians are the key but for most of them due to the attitude of upper management it becomes a tedious and unglamorous job with no incentives for growth, after all its the guys in sales/marketing who sip cocktails with the who's who at swanky parties that move up into senior management while these people are the very pillar on which the industry stands but no one cares about them "

An over simplifcation, S.

More later if anyone is still interested.

Gotta run and take care of something urgent.