Comments:
This message has been edited by mac_omega on 2014-09-12 23:23:08
Identify a vintage Dennison cased Omega
Hi Guys,
just wondering whether anyone can confirm if this is worth a buy? According to the seller it's a 1946 Omega movt in a 9ct gold Dennison case. I've already confirmed with the seller that the case and caseback marry up, and the hallmark date on the case seems to marry up with the serial number date on the movement but there is something about the face that i'm just not sure about...The seller confirmed one of the hands is not original, but as far as they know, the face hasn't been refinished. However, I can't find anywhere, another watch with the same face? It seems to be very similar to dennison cased Omega cal 269's from 1950's/60's but then has other features on the face, such as the ring of markings on the outer edge of the dial? Also, them 50's/60's watches are 34mm as far as i know wheras this is 30mm. So is this a bit of a custom job on the face or is it original do you think?
I just don't want to part with cash for what may turn out to be not a wholly original piece! Other than this nagging doubt, i like the watch and the seller has been nothing but helpful. So it's not that i'm questioning their honesty, just a nagging doubt that i can't appease! Help!
Thanks
T
Nice looking watch.
Clean looking T26.5 movement in a nice case. Not too sure of the originality of the dial, however, the pictures aren't too good. IMHO the subseconds markers should be precisely located at the periphery of the sunken area with no gap, so maybe a non-factory refinish. Still it would be a nice piece for regular wear if you aren't too fussy.
I've recently been wearing my two 30mm Omegas from the 1940s and they're cracking good movements, both still amazingly accurate although almost 70 years old. Also a pleasure to wind every night. One of them is a recent refinish but I still enjoy wearing it.
Nice movement
Hi
very nice movement, it is of the 30T2 series (look under the balance wheel and you will see exactly which - I would guess a 30T2AM as it does not have parachoc/incabloc.
Case is a Dennison, hour hand is a correct leaf hand, the minute hand is a stick hand from another watch.
The dial is obviously an old redial, first because the border of the subseconds dial is smoothened by teh paint, while it should be sharp. Second, because as SteveW pointed out the five-seconds rail in the small dial is incorrect (and also may be out of center).
The case cannot be 30mm, because the movement is 30mm itself (they are called "30mm") so it is more like 32-33mm at least. The movement is of the same series (30mm) of the 269 you mention. They changed nomenclature in 1949, and became like this:
BWs
Franco
This message has been edited by Franco on 2014-09-12 15:49:14 This message has been edited by Franco on 2014-09-12 15:53:16
very nice movement, it is of the 30T2 series (look under the balance wheel and you will see exactly which - I would guess a 30T2AM as it does not have parachoc/incabloc.
Case is a Dennison, hour hand is a correct leaf hand, the minute hand is a stick hand from another watch.
The dial is obviously an old redial, first because the border of the subseconds dial is smoothened by teh paint, while it should be sharp. Second, because as SteveW pointed out the five-seconds rail in the small dial is incorrect (and also may be out of center).
The case cannot be 30mm, because the movement is 30mm itself (they are called "30mm") so it is more like 32-33mm at least. The movement is of the same series (30mm) of the 269 you mention. They changed nomenclature in 1949, and became like this:
30T2PCAM = 260
30T2PCAM = 261
30T2RG = 262
30T3PCAM = 265
30T3PCAM = 266
30T4PCAM = 267
30T5PCAM = 268
30 T6 PC AM = 269
BWs
Franco
This message has been edited by Franco on 2014-09-12 15:49:14 This message has been edited by Franco on 2014-09-12 15:53:16
Agreed with Steve and Franco, Terry . . .
. . . the dial doesn't look original to my eyes, either. Still, worth getting if you can keep an eye out for an original, which, paradoxically, is easier now than ever due to wholesale scrapping of gold cases. Typically, the movement and dial are packaged together, so you'll get spare parts as well.
Cordially,
Art
Sorry, but I must disagree...
Sorry Steve and Franco,
but I must disagree about the movement caliber.
It is neither a 26,5 (as Steve guessed), which looks completely different - nor a Caliber out of the 30mm line (as Franco wrote) which are similar I must admit.
But there are so many differences that it is not so hard to distinguish.
It is a Cal. 28 (later called 360) - and this movement is 28 mm in diameter as the caliber name unveils versus 30mm of the 26X (cal 30) family.
Below you find a picture for comparison.
I have done a little photoshopping and have marked the differences with red arrows - you see there are plenty of them...
Cal 28 (360) is a very slim movement which allowed to build very elegant watches with small height.
HAGWE
erich
This message has been edited by mac_omega on 2014-09-12 23:23:08
Well spotted!
I admit I assumed the movement was T26.5 because of the watch's size without doing due diligence. Over the years I've never seen a T28 so maybe it's somewhat rare. On the other hand I probably ignored most 30mm diameter watches.
If the OP likes a smaller watch it might be an interesting one to own. On the other hand over the years I have tended to wear my smaller watches less and less. For example an inherited 14K gold Hamilton Brock at 26mm x 20mm. I finally got tired of explaining that I wasn't wearing a woman's watch.
Thanks!
Thanks for all of the information guys...been a brilliant help! The vendor says that the concentric circles in the sub second dial are still crisp so that's why they believe it isn't a refinish. I think the markings do go to the edge on the sub second dial, but there is I believe a small campher around the edge which the photos dont show too well, so that it appears they dont go to the edge
Where would you start looking for replacement parts. The finish has worn off the crown for instance and the minute hand is non original, but as this would be my first vintage piece, part sourcing is new to me!
Finally, whilst I know thats not the aim of these forums, where would your guidance be price wise?
Thanks
Terry
Where would you start looking for replacement parts. The finish has worn off the crown for instance and the minute hand is non original, but as this would be my first vintage piece, part sourcing is new to me!
Finally, whilst I know thats not the aim of these forums, where would your guidance be price wise?
Thanks
Terry
There are vendors on Ebay that offer vintage movements . . .
. . . with their respective dials, salvaged from cases that've been scrapped for their gold content. Find the movement, and chances are you'll eventually find the dial. That could take years, but it's been done before. I've managed the feat, although only in an academic sense: passed on a refinished ref 2782 a few years ago, only to discover a correct dial on Ebay earlier this year.
Personally, I wouldn't make an offer on the one you're considering unless it was offered at essentially scrap price. My guess would be around twelve grams of gold content.
Cordially,
Art
You are right !!
Yes - totally right ! After having seen hundreds, without attention I missed the right points to watch!
Well done Eric
Franco
Well done Eric
Franco