Comments:
On the subject of bevels...
I heard in some of Tim Mosso's latest videos that the calibres in the Fifty Fathoms line have fully machine finished bevels. I really trust his judgement and knowledge, so this news is a bit crushing.
I always had heard they were started mechanically and then finished off by hand. Is there any way for one to tell? I don't have a loupe, but my macro photos also didn't offer signs to me that these were fully done by machine. For example, the Speedmaster has anglage that is fully machine cut, but the marks on it are clear. I am curious what you all think or know, since this problem only came to me today as I watched some of his content...
Comparatively, the bevels on my 1315 appear much smoother...so I don't know what to think.
In these last photos that follow, you can see there are machining marks and lack of continued, mirrored and more rounded bevels. So it appears corners are being cut, but not very visibly...but it looks like a lot of the bevelling is mirrored and rounded, which is better than not. But I've heard there are very good machines that can do excellent bevels without human help. I'm hoping this isn't one of those cases.
The question "What counts as hand-finishing?" can have many answers
One can argue that using a hand-held rotary tool to polish bevels is a form of hand-finishing (a technique used by Patek) while another may argue that the polishing should be done without power tools to be classified as hand-finishing. The term "hand finished" really is an umbrella term used by watch manufacturers that includes techniques using power tools while giving the impression of it being a solely human-driven process.
Photo ”borrowed" from revolutionwatch.com
I do not know the details about Blancpain but I imagine they are hand-finished utilizing rotary tools similar to most Pateks. I suspect that the tooling marks seen on bridges under magnification aren't necessarily a sign that it is completely machine finished, but rather the watchmaker applying the hand finishing step didn't do a complete job. You can find similar images of other brands' movements having below expectations beveling, and I usually think it was a QC issue rather than a sign that the movement was only machine finished. (Of course there are movements that are only machine finished, I am referring to movements that are marketed as being hand finished.)
Photo ”borrowed" from revolutionwatch.com
Yes, I think the hand-held buffing tool counts as hand work.
It need not be gentian wood with paste or what have you, but your point about machining marks is interesting. I think it would be nice if we had other movements to compare to from other owners' photos. This is just what I noticed on my own model.
Thanks for your helpful remarks.
You might be interested by
this Sjx article, where they describe the finishing of caliber 1315 in the following way:
The movement decoration appears simple because it lacks contrast. The most obvious decorative element is the solid gold rotor, but even that has been dressed in a discreet matte grey.
But under magnification the movement is evidently finished well, especially considering the nature of the Bathyscaphe and its price. The bridges have a fine radial graining with prominent, polished bevelling.
Because the bridges are numerous, there is a substantial length of bevelling across the movement. The bevelling appears to have been first done by machine, then given a once over by a hand-held polishing tool to create a rounded, mirrored finish.
The densely arranged bridges mean that little beneath is visible, but based on images of disassembled Blancpain movements I’ve seen, I expect the hidden components to be equally neatly finished.
Best.
Except few independents, the majority are CNC finished
As Brandon has pointed out, the use of power tools is largely adopted and can be classified as Hand Made, though it's a misty definition unless we set some additional parameters.
Hand made with power trolls tools (98% of productions) and hand made with wooden sticks and tiny rods, no electric stuff.
Hand made with power trolls tools (98% of productions) and hand made with wooden sticks and tiny rods, no electric stuff.
I believe they are finished off by hand.
I have seen a few of these now and they looked quite hand finished to me. Actually, they seemed better done than patek or even AP.
To swatch group’s credit, both Blancpain and Breguet offer amazing levels of finish at the price point!
Okay, duly noted...
I agree with you, it does seem really amazing at the price and I have heard the better than AP/Patek remark before. So this is good news.
My understanding the last few years is that FF/1315/1150 bevels have been mechanically applied for a long time now
The effect is incredible, but dullness around corners led me to the same conclusion that these are not hand-finished bevels. I suspect they are created using the same technology and equipment employed on the caliber 1863 display caseback Moonwatch calibers -- another Swatch Group product that featured stunningly polished but mass produced bevels. But the FF movement still looks great! I'm still open to my long-held belief that these are given a final pass with a drill bit buffer held by hand, but I need to see the process to really know at this point.
Best,
Tim
My guess is they are still done by hand with an electric buffer. If there was a machine to fully automate this process, I think the results would be more perfect 😂
The corners in particular are a little inconsistent from one to the next which I would have expected to be more perfect and precise if machine guided. Additionally, if there is a fully automated machine for this I surprised this cost cut in the transition to the 3861 which came with a big price hike. I don't have an open caseback FF anymore but my 500F (from Watchbox 
) was nicely done. That said, if there is a machine to do this level of polish in an automated fashion which sounds totally plausible, I wish more brands would adopt these. Imagine if a modern Royal Oak looked like this on the movement side....
) was nicely done. That said, if there is a machine to do this level of polish in an automated fashion which sounds totally plausible, I wish more brands would adopt these. Imagine if a modern Royal Oak looked like this on the movement side....
Ah.
So the best explanation is right now that they're like the Speedmaster, but possibly that they're finalized by hand. Understood, thanks Tim. I tried asking the brand about it, but there was no response from them for over two weeks now. So I guess I'll take you at your word!
It's very possible
I don't want to lead anyone astray. My videos reflect my best understanding at the time I record them, and I never embellish to make a sale. Really, it wasn't until I started taking macro still photos of the 1315 that I began to wonder whether some kind of advanced process was achieving those gorgeous rounded and mirrored bevels.
The current display caseback Omega 3861 isn't finished like the old 1863, and that movement - particularly the chronograph bridge and clutch - had remarkably handsome polished bevels. They were straight rather than the rounded contour of the Blancpain 1315, but it got me thinking about what Swatch was capable of with sufficient budget and intent. I know that final-pass bevel polishing with a motorized buffing tool is very common; the only question is whether Blancpain specifically employs it in this case. More than anyone, I want to know.
Best,
Tim
Best,
Tim
Okay. This is super interesting.
I will keep my eye out for more info over time. But you and I are in the same position: we'd just like to know the answer!
I actually find caliber 1315 to be nicely finished and one of the most accurate caliber I have owned . You have everything here to be happy with such a caliber in your watch! Enjoy
I don't doubt it!
I just wanted to know how this part of the movement is produced and whether it is by machine or not. Would add to the romanticism and align with the advertising if it was finished by hand (the handheld buffing tool counts).