Independents

So, it seems the tantalum version of the Grönograaf was up for reservation a lot longer than needed to sell 25 pieces. They‘ve written, that they’ve done a raffle to decide who gets a tantalum Grönograaf. Of course, that‘s easy to write, but can‘t really be proven. So I‘m interested now: Everyone else got that raffle mail? And anyone else here got declined? Or am I the only one (which i shouldn‘t if it really was a raffle).  I‘m actually most disappointed about just getting downgraded to the steel version and not being offered any compensation for the downgrade. What‘s everyone else‘s reaction?

Seems like some brands, such as H. Moser, are doing these things to build a mailing list or ????  Obviously no one should be forced to settle for a stainless-steel version if you reserved tantalum.

There are many excellent choices within that price range (or less). No worries, in a year or so as this bubble comes back down to Earth we'll all remember how various manufacturers behaved... and choose our future purchasing of timepieces accordingly. Have already done this with two brands.

I can appreciate the demand for the tantalum but disagree with the process. I placed my reservation early in the morning as soon as I saw the notice from the brothers in my inbox. Being in the US I imagine the time difference put me at a disadvantage. May have been fairer to include all reservations in a lottery? I have 3 Gronefelds and that did not seem to count for any consideration. At any rate I shall pass on the s/s version as the price differential for 7x the quantity (188) does not resonate with me. My 2 cents. BTW-I am very happy for the brothers. Good guys and they have another hit for sure!   

The tantalum watch was up for reservation for 3-4 hours. I‘ve send in my reservation less than 10 minutes after the website going live. Also bought my first Grönefeld when delivery time was still 2-4 months and they were happy about every single customer. And now they‘re telling me being early for reservations didn‘t matter, but if i want a ss version, it‘s who pays first will get it first? No structure in the process at all. If they would’ve created a special ss version for those who missed out, i might have gone for it. But I agree with you, the common ss is not an appropriate replacment if you were sure to get a tantalum one. I will also not go for it.

While a first come first serve approach might seem most fair, that also might lead to buying behaviors that perhaps they don't want to promote. For example, the MAD1 lottery was partly to deal with less supply than demand and also partly to try to change the hype/drop mentality where being first was promoting flipping versus a more contemplative and thoughtful buying. Sometimes the first people to checkout are the super fans, these days they are just as likely to be the professional flippers. I think Gronefeld did a respectable thing in closing the order books when things got out of hand and I think this is also nod to their fans and collectors as well saying that everyone interested in the tantalum version is equally valued, whether they were first or last. At the other end of the spectrum, they could have just offered the tantalum versions to their top 25 customers and this all would have been moot. Any efforts by brands to create more equal access in a world of VIPs and pre-sold limited editions is a wonderful thing IMHO. 

The MAD one was designed to be a lottery from the very beginning. Everyone who applied for it knew, what they were in for. The Grönograaf preordering process didn‘t mention anything like this at any time until we received the email almost a week after signing up. This wasn‘t a „we want to be fair to all people“ process. It was more of a „shit, our preorder process isn‘t working! We‘re getting too much orders! We need to do something! Quick let‘s do a brainstorming!“ process. There‘s a huge difference between these two from the customers perspective. I would agree with you, if it would‘ve been known to be a lottery from the very beginning, I do not agree with you under the given circumstances. Also, VIPs did get special information about the new watches upfront the release. This does not go well with the „equality to all customers“ approach.

Openness and transparency was largely discussed at Watches & Wonders only a few short months ago. Perhaps some manufacturers need to (re)watch the video from that seminar.

That said, no one was harmed, seems an honest mistake, beyond a sincere apology I wouldn't expect compensation.

I celebrated too soon.  Received the ‘raffle mail’ offering the SS compensation prize but not sure I’m going to take given I was particularly interested in the Tantalum (and pointing out that the SS is slightly lighter and probably more comfortable to wear isn’t going to sway me).  Hey ho :-(

Seems to me they're copying that MAD Edition RED watch from MB&F which was also raffled, but they announced this raffle thing too late after people already ordered the watch, whereas MB&F announced the raffle thing from the beginning when the watch was first announced.  I think the brothers have messed it up a little.  I probably would've advised the Brothers against this move.  But they didn't ask me and I didn't offer. 

Yes, in the past, on WatchProSite, we had elaborate raffles. I remember the Woo brothers would write down the names of members who entered the raffle, these names would then go on individual Post-Its that were all stuck to their living room wall. Then, there'd be a toy Nerf gun, fired randomly by someone who hadn't seen the names on the wall. That was an elaborate set up!

Who really cares whether it’s 25 or maybe 50 timepieces? They would only have to order an additional batch of cases.

I would assume, that some ultra important customers were not quick enough for a "first come first serve". So now they needed to change the allocation and the email is what they tell the mortals.

. I know its tough for such a small brand with high demand to think of a fair and honest system, there will always be people upset. And I don’t think the SS version is a downgrade imho

And sorry, but everyone (ok, let‘s say 99,9% of all people) who know watches will tell you a 188 piece ss version at 155k is a downgrade vs a 25 piece tantalum version at 165k.

Ofcourse if you look at the exclusivity (188 vs 25) I understand your point but still a SS version is as beautiful as the Tantalum imho .
I am not familiar with the email you got from them so I can’t say if its fair or not .
If i was in the market for a Gronograaf i would have been happy with a steel one as well .
I opted for a steel Remontoire over a gold case back then and the price difference wasn’t that much .

The brothers won't find a one size fits all solution here, but a third case material is probably best. Too many of the recent independent releases have been sold out before they hit the public, so collectors will assume the same VIPs were accommodated in an unfair fashion, once again. Even though the most probable cause is the simplest: a small business messed up their web ordering system and they didn't consult a PR specialist to deal with it.

so I wouldn't personally question fairness of allocation IMHO.

And again, this is not about not getting the tantalum, this is about a company creating hype for days and giving customers information on what‘s going to happen and what one then needs to do and afterwards not being prepared the slightest to deal with the hype and not sticking to the rules they‘ve made themselves. I did not get the money needed to be able to spend 160k on a watch by doing business like that. We‘re talking a lot of money here. I‘ve been at a food truck yesterday. Wanted a fish burger, the owner burnt the last burger bun in front of my eyes and then apologized and asked me, if i wanted to choose something else from the menu and he‘ll give it to me for half the price. I did still pay full price for the replacement, as it‘s not the type of business where you earn a lot, but his reaction was great. (No, I did not expect to get the steel version for half the price of course, before someone asks this stupid question…)

I agree with you. Same situation, and feels exactly the same. Certainly v disappointed ☹️.