Independents

dotman
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Huh?

Hi MTF;

Not trying to cause any problems, but I'm just generally confused about a few things here...

"Strictly speaking, the word "independent" has the least influence as criterium to be on this forum"

"Strictly speaking" - that's a good flexile phrase.  "Strictly speaking" is like trying to nail jell-o to a tree.

"See Calabrese explains AHCI qualifications: click here"

Okay..

"... A watchmaker can be a member of AHCI if he is independant.."

Let's see... last I checked Sarpaneva watches weren't funded by anyone other than the guy making the watches.  That's a bit more than can be said for some of the brands previously mentioned in this forum.  But we'll come back to that later...

"...and craftsman..."

Does being born into a 200 year old family lineage characterized by blacksmiths and jewellers make one a craftsman?  Maybe not, but it's a good start. Having the ability to construct and finish in-house hands, machine brass and aluminum dials, and finish raw cases does - at least on this side of the pond, make one a craftsman.

"...doing himself at least one part of the work he presents, like adding a new complication."

One part of the work?  I think Sarpaneva completed over 40 modifications to the movement found in the Supernova, which began life as a 2824.  That was before he deconstructed the running seconds and threw in a moonphase.

...everything after this explanation has nothing to do with being a watchmaker, but rather getting on board the AHCI expositions.  Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't serve much purpose in a forum that allows non-AHCI members to be discussed.

"With increased exposure and more collectors, membership of AHCI became quite attractive and many candidates appeared. Some did not qualify, were rejected or "withdrew their applications". Others did not even apply, choosing to find fame and money by just forming new brands because they could ride on the crest of the watch collecting wave without passing muster or meister status by peer review"

Ride the crest of the watch collecticting wave?  Whoa, let's not get carried away here.  Even if Stepan did leave the Swiss horology-hub to take his family back to Finland, I guess I still wouldn't be especially impressed.  Because yes, he still does sell watches.  For what it's worth, a man has to eat.

"Some brands, although "independent", do not get discussed because the community does not really see them as independent & high horology.......yet."

Independent and high horology?  Let's see, Sarpaneva did the typical independent shuffle: joined watchmaking school at 19, master watchmaker at 24, a notable restorer and assembler of complicated pieces - working in the arteliers of Piaget, Parmigiani, Vianney Halter, and Christophe Claret.  Well, at least his resume seems to check out.

"PPro does not implicitly nor explicitly list brands who have made it to the expectations of the moderators and/or community."

Trying to go back & forth between the community and moderators 'expectations' is an interesting, albeit confused, way to backpedal out of this.

"In case of doubt, post on general HoMe forum and if the community deems it "high horology" the moderators may probably move it to this forum....."

There we go with that community/moderators thing again...

"The converse may be true.....should we then move things out of this forum onto the general pages? Would that be fair to the AHCI and high horology masters to let ANY watch remain on this forum?"

Somehow, I don't suspect that any feathers will be ruffled from the AHCI Gods Above if we should happen to mention Sarpaneva watches here - especially since many of them are his friends.

"A previous thread asked specifically about a certain brand (Not Sarpaneva) that posted itself on these pages..... Let's say a new brand (making honest but adequate watches) appears on this forum posting directly (tacky) or indirectly posted by others (not so tacky), do we apply the general rule and see how much interest it garners from the high-traffic general discussion page (HoMe) or let it get buried in the lower-traffic AHCI page?"

I think most would agree here that this would be comparable to posting a New Arrival Patek Wristshot on the Panerai forum.

"What does Mr Sarpaneva say about his own watches? Have a look here; click here"

Ok.

"He is not a member of AHCI.......yet."

That's right.  And neither are more half the other threads on Page 1 of this forum related to any AHCI members.

"I think, for now, the fledgling brand needs more exposure on general forums."

"Fledgling brand" - seems to be an reasonably awkward way of referring to someone.  Anyhow - you have my opinion, plain as day.

-Paul