Audemars Piguet

The terrific photo of the 'pianoforte Millenary' by AucklandKiwi a few threads below is a wistful reminder that this is not the RO/ROO forum, but the AP forum.  

Even if the octagon still tends to dominate.  It is understandable, but many of us also love the other lines. 

...and for the lovely tribute to Maranello.

But I believe his watch would be a tribute to Bologna or Modena  (which are the original and later homes of Maserati).  Maranello is home to Ferrari. 

Great watches and a very nice idea to have a thread dedicated to the NON-RO/NON-ROO models.  I look forward to seeing more photos.

Best regards,

Dino

Two of mine... the 4101, incredibly captured here by our own Fx:

And the 2012 Gstaad Classic... I really like this one:

That's a beauty Pplater, I really love the Jules ligne and this one in particular.
Cheers from rainy and cold Perth. Francois

But I do agree with you that summing a brand to one watch is exasperating.

So many nice watches exist, beside the Royal Oak.

And so many Royal Oak are not that interesting, at least from my point of view.

While in the haute horlogerie, there are some monsters ( in the good meaning of the word, to avoid any confusion ) at AP.

Yours is one of them.

Some skeleton Perpetual Calendars are another nice example.

The Millenary Starwheel is another one, too.

Aaah, I am just sharing my wish list, here...



Best,

Nicolas

the market has, in the past, bought more RO and ROOS, than other models - Millenary, JA, Edward Piguet, Carnegie, etc.

before that, the classique, the Huitieme, and numerous unnamed model lines over the decades.

The market has turned the RO / ROOS into a runaway market success; AP as a commercial enterprise (but with, hopefully, some "puristic" roots guiding some decisions...) and thus plans new models and production based upon market demand.

I'm at a bit of a loss where "fault" lies in that.

So are they supposed to, then, keep producing more, say, Millenaries, far more than the market accepts, and far fewer RO / ROOS than the market wants?

This issue of the strength of the RO / ROOS lines, and a sub issue, that of all the limited editions, rears it's perennial head, seldom with a sensical context. I'm not saying there is no room for personal feelings ("i just dont like the RO / ROOS" or "i despise limited editions" or even "there are just too many limited editions for my taste") but most of the slags are presented somehow matter of factly or under the guise of statements of objective fact.

Im just not following how there is "fault" here...

cheers,

TM

Thomas, 


This message has been edited by Mostel on 2012-08-12 15:43:05

you and Nico and Moc and all the others who love to keep bringing up this point about AP and RO/ROOS and limited editions...then you'd have to do it about MjLC as well... and (gasp) PP...and (GASP! Horrors) Dufour...after all, wasn't a certain"simple" model extended another 100 pieces when it was originally released as a series of 100?

As you say, "you can't have it both ways" - not even us, the self appointed guardians of standards.

If one is going to go about haranguing, then do so fairly and across the board - all brands, and even "our" beloved independents, expand production to meet demand, focus on models that sell well, and sometimes, just sometimes, create arunaway homeruns.

It seems hardly fair to pick and choose whom one constantly decides to picket when those same individuals frequently then turn a blind eye to "personal favorites." seems as "offensive" as those acts they are decrying.

my suggestion? turn off the broken record.

To be clear -

Im not a fan of the "endless limited editions" - hear that, AP? PP? IWC? MJLC? et al?
even...gasp...Lamborghini!

and before anyone claims "TM, blind fanboy defender of AP who can't allow any criticism of his favorite brand" I would, and have, do the same for any individuals who constantly, like a broken record, harangue PP for their commercial policies, or MJLC for theirs, or IWC, or...

now if anyone had LEGITIMATE concerns that are not JUST personal feelings, like legitimate quality control issues in design or production, excessively high DOA rates, etc...go for it!

TM

or any of the other perennial hit list of "wrongs" that AP supposedly commits -

1. too much dominance of RO / ROOS on these boards - post original posts about non- RO's; support non-RO threads and models; BUY them! and share them here (again, thank you, pplater)

I am, will be, MUCH more tolerant of slags and swipes at RO and ROOS "dominance" for OP ( original posts and posters) who actually do something about that "dominance" by posting balancing original threads about non RO / ROOS.

I will be less tolerant of follow up dogpiles...

and I will be INtolerant of new posts and threads which ONLY whine about the subject.

Broken record, OFF!

:-(

2. too many LE's - dont buy them if you dont like them!

if you want to whine about it here, then whine about it at the same time in AT LEAST 50% of the other brand forums that produce "limited editions" - including Rolex, MJLC, Omega, yes, even PP.

broken record - OF!

3. too much production for a "rare, precious" object - oh, please.

same rule here as in 2 - Every brand most be thus harangued, you can't pick and choose your whipping boy. including the independents.

I see and agree about the certain hyprocrisy IN THE ENTIRE INDUSTRY where they claim difficulty in production, rarity resulting, etc, and then slap them out like a printing machine.

What I have a problem with is picking certain "favorite" brands to go on haranguing about.

Now if anyone wants to pick on MARKETING mesages that offends the reality, I'm still in a much more tolerant stage on that, but be specific.

TM

It was not intended that we might 'go down that road' again, so apologies if that has become the case.

From a personal perspective, any commercial imperative, any commercial strategy, for any product or any brand, is wholly legitimate whether the end goal is market penetration, market dominance, bulk sales by discount or occasional sales by premium. Provided always that there is no sleight of hand, we can buy into it or opt out of it at our own election: good luck to the wolves, tough luck for the sheep.

Whatever AP does - ditto PP, VC, Rolex etc ad infinitum - is their own call, for the ultimate benefit of their stakeholders. Bravo to the companies who get that right; hard luck those who don't.

This thread had a much humbler, less partisan origin. There are some shiny things with an octagonal bezel; there are some shiny things without - let's see some of the shiny things without. It is clear that you understood those original sentiments, and thank you for that. For those who may not have realised that it was that simple: it was.

Anyhow: how about it, TM? You must have a couple of beauties lurking somewhere on your hard drive; can you be persuaded to roll 'em out?

All the best,

Cheers,
pplater.

and unintentionally hijacking your great OP! :-(

I applaud your approach, thank you.

I am traveling (three countries in five days) and upside down on my timezones. Maybe I shouldn't address "broader issues" in this state, but sometimes...

:-(

I do have some (in fact several) non octagonal AP's; in fact I only got my FIRST octagon some decades after my love affair with AP started. But alas, that HDD is not with me on this trip.

Cheers,

TM

I am certainly first and foremost a fan of AP's Royal Oak.  Its really the AP that first captured my attention.  However, I would love to see some photos of other APs of the past and present which are not ROs or ROOs.. 

I remember in the 1980s AP had a "Bamboo" watch, they had some classic round watches with cars engraved on gold dials, they also had one of the first wrist watch Tourbillons which I believe was in a rectangular case with rounded edges, and then there are the more recent models such as the Star Wheel (round or Millenary case), Schaeffer, JA, EP etc.

Best regards,

Dino

I actually like that AP has supposedly 'so' many LEs. Its an amazing design laboratory that

that's an interesing psycho analysis.

Thanks,

TM

let me explain a little bit my point of view,as you mentioned my name. This message has been edited by moc on 2012-08-13 08:28:03

assume no familiarity with me.

Thus, please allow me the courtesy of moderating this forum as I see fit, You don't know me well enough to tell me how to moderate it.

that said, my apologies if my impression of any persistent negativity on your part was incorrect or malapropos. I hate to be wrong, but I'm not too stubborn to admit it when I am. So if you have

1. been fair across brands in certain "issues" of principle

and

2. proportionate in your contributions of any given brand, positive to negative, negative to positive,

then again, my apologies.

TM

Never it was my intention at all,but since my name was called i thought to drop a line.

Thomas,

how many versions of certain base models did they release?

and this against a total production of how many?

Come on, Mostel, dont put me in the awkward position of pointing out things which I dont personally have an issue with, just to make a point about a meta-issue.

Pretty please? (I could name many more...)

And by the way, I AM ThomasM, but that doesn't mean my OPINION is gospel or always correct - I've never felt this way, don't feel this way now, and please shoot me if I ever do. But this is a different issue than how I feel I should moderate this forum - there I do have to make decisions and enforce such decisions, much as I find that aspect of moderating distasteful.

What is at issue here is the repeated to the point of nauseum "I hate (all) their limited editions" or "all this forum posts about are RO/ROOS" WITHOUT an attempt at something positive, something positive like what pplater did in the OP to this thread.

You've been around long enough, Mostel, that I hope you understand the distinction I am making, the line I am drawing and why, and that we can have this head butting without being offended or pissed off beyond redemption.

and without assuming undue familiarity, as Moc so rightly points out.

Cheers,

TM

Included AP.

My point was to say that AP can't be summed to the Royal Oak.

But ask to people who don't know much about AP. They will say " Royal Oak ", and better " Off Shore " while there are many other ( more? ) interesting models at AP.

People used to say Reverso when they think JLC.

Do I like that?

Certainly not. Obce again, we can't sum a brand to a watch.

Why is it,in my opinion, a bit AP's fault? Because of so many evolutions from the same watch...

While AP  could also put the light on many of their other sublime production.

It is a marketting game, which is not only reserved to AP, once again.

That is just my point of view, of course.

Best!

Nicolas

And thank you for referencing my post above! I only have the one Audemars Piguet (the Millenary Pianoforte), but might spring for a Millenary Quincy Jones or Jules Audemars Ultra-Thin over the next few years.

Hi Kevin,

Is that those non RO's are stratospheric  

...thank you for the reminder. Still, not all of the non-RO need to be stratospheric, do they? Aren't there some simple JA models? Even some vintage - do we not have any vintage here? The value in vintage never ceases to amaze.

Thanks again.

Cheers,
pplater.

While the RO turned me on to AP and the Jumbo is my all time favorite RO, over the years I have acquired two non RO AP pieces that are both very special to me.  As far as LE's I could care less if a watch is a LE or non LE, it is all about if "I" really like the watch or not.  I have zero faith in buying a LE or non LE for value appreciation, I wear my watches and they get beat up.  

JerryW This message has been edited by JerryW on 2012-08-12 19:37:27

...can't get enough of that 'brother from another mother'.

An EoT set to Vienna??? There HAS to be a story there, doesn't there?

Cheers,
pplater.