Back to the AMVOX III and Ceramic cases in general

I am returning to a previous thread about theAMVOX III. Don't blame me, Nicolas started it!

There has been, I am sure, discussions here about the differences among ceramic, carbon fiber and DLC cases -- so perhaps someone can point me to a previous thread or two on this subject. I have done a search but could not find what I am looking for, which is a comparison of the hardness and scratch resistancy as well as a review of the pros and cons of these materials when deployed in making watch cases. I am sure I have read something about this here before but cannot find it now.

I continue to obsess over the AMVOX III. I think this has something to do with the full ceramic case (v. just the bezel) surrounding a very fine and technically interesting tourbillon movement. I am not seeing a lot of other examples of ceramic-cased watches that really grab me as this one does. I must admit that the AP Survivor (which is DLC with a ceramic bezel) comes the closest, but that is an entirely different beast. I am trying to sort out if I am just looking for a really awesome watch with a ceramic case or if I simply want the AMVOX III. But in any case, I think it is time for me to learn a little more about alternative materials for watch cases.

I have to say, as far as JLC watches are concerned, I really envy the ladies with the Ladies Master Compressor Diving GMT Lady Ceramique, which now comes not only with a ceramic case but also with a ceramic wrsitband. Ceramic seems like it would be a great material for diving watches (again, please, someone educate me!), and I have not yet seen any other watches coming with a ceramic braclet.

Any and all thoughts welcome.

respo

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Hi Respo!

By: blomman Mr Blue : May 3rd, 2010-13:34

I don’t know much about these materials – personally I prefer more traditional case materials. But if I am not miss informed – RADO has been working with ceramics for many years. Ceramics both for case and bracelet, what I am not sure ab...

Some elements of answers, Respo.

By: amanico : May 3rd, 2010-13:47

Among the 3 most known black cases ( PVD, DLC and Ceramic ), the Ceramic is the hardest material. PVD and DLC are applied on SS or titanium cases, SS been the softer ( 600 Vickers ), then the Titanium, and the harder being the Ceramic with 1 500 Vickers. ...

That is very helpful -- thank you.

By: respo : May 3rd, 2010-17:56

I have not been a fan of black watches either, but recently the AMVOX II and AMVOX III (and a couple of non-JLC watches) have been making me re-think this. Thanks for the response. respo

Ceramic may be the hardest...

By: fernando : May 3rd, 2010-20:24

and most scratch resistant of the three but the payoff is its brittleness.Case in point: a friend's IWC Top Gun (ceramic case) was taken to the official service centre for a simple strap replacement.It came back with a noticeable chip on the underside of ...

a few quick thoughts...

By: ThomasM : May 3rd, 2010-20:25

Hi, Respo, Your question touches on a very sophisticated and complex field, to be sure. Too often, discussions on this subject use terms that are not well defined by the parties engaged in the discussion, so the conclusions can be fraught with out of cont...

Cross-posting...

By: BDLJ : May 4th, 2010-00:15

Just read your excellent post above, TM and realised that our initial responses arrived within a few minutes of each other. To clarify, my post was in response to Nico....but you put it far more eruditely than I. Young's Modulus, tensile strength, compres...

Wootz steel...

By: ThomasM : May 4th, 2010-02:11

It's been quite a few years, Ben; have to go back and refresh the old brain cells... Thanks for the kind words, they are hardly deserving. What I shared was a 3 draft, but far from final. I just wish I had the time to go back and really finish them off an...

Very helpful Thomas...

By: respo : May 4th, 2010-05:44

...and I believe the material you wrote prior to the introduction of the AP Grand Prix is what I recall having read before. I am grateful for the reminder and the re-reading of this now. I am not sure it is helping me come to any conclusions, but it is ma...

Ceramics and Ceramics...

By: BDLJ : May 3rd, 2010-20:28

Hmm. PVD and CVD are not materials, they are the process used to deposit the coating on the substrate. It's the properties of the coating that will determine the harness/scratch resistance/etc of the case. Ceramics: Usually PVD/CVD is used to deposit a co...

Who mentioned CVD?

By: ThomasM : May 3rd, 2010-21:07

Oh, yeah, that would be me. Thanks for the rigour in the use of the terminology; indeed, your clarifications are very important and much too often either unclear, ambiguous, or simply misunderstood. But Ben, "DLC is similar to PVD, in that it's a coating ...

Busted!

By: BDLJ : May 3rd, 2010-23:15

You got me, TM. Anyway CVD is for ICs...not our lovely watch cases... I tried to put forth what little imput I could re: DLC (in comparison with TiN/TiAlN) in that it doesn't provide a not a completely homogenous case and is a surface treatment, and was g...

LOL! We're hijacking the OP...

By: ThomasM : May 4th, 2010-02:16

but hey, thanks for the clarification. Since I saw that I was the first in this thread to mention CVD I thought maybe you were busting my chops (deservedly, mind you!) and I had to bust you right back... But man oh man! "Thanks for the rigour in the use o...

Thanks BDLJ

By: respo : May 4th, 2010-05:47

I appreciate the clarifications and the succinct summary of the major pros and cons of ceramics. I will continue to search and read more about this. Your opinions and thoughts on this are exactly what I was hoping for when I raised the questions in my ori...

No problem, Respo

By: BDLJ : May 4th, 2010-17:20

All this stuff is very mystifying. And please feel free to keep asking, too. As you can see from the amount of discussion, clarification, contextualisation in the back-and-forth between TM and I, nothing is cut and dried. If it were, we could just present...

Good guidelines

By: respo : May 4th, 2010-18:14

Thanks BDLJ. I think those are pretty good guidelines, especially teh final one. LOL. You are right, of course, if one really loves the watch, the case material is likely to be immaterial. And then you raise the issue of use of a watch for its intended pu...

So Rado and JLC Ceramic May Be Similar...

By: JLC Enthusiast : August 11th, 2013-11:47

Thanks for the useful post, as an owner of a few Rado Ceramics an interesting discussion here and makes me want to try a Ceramic JLC....

Simply the best watch

By: Oztimelord : August 16th, 2013-18:34

Hi, I have an AMVOX III in RG and it is simply the best and most practical tourbillon watch. Also when I wear it I tend to get the most positive feedback due to the depth of the dial. The case is great as it doesn't scratch from sensible daily wear and th...