Hi All, Upon finding out this “unique” 5531 (due to a beautiful bracelet) would be auctioned off, I was disappointed that the owner who bought it in February 2020 would already be selling.

Nov 08, 2020,10:29 AM

Aside from making a good profit, do you think that there could be other legitimate reasons why the owner had to sell ?

What is going on ?  Did the AD perform its proper due diligence ?  Other reasons or thoughts ?

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And a second question that I have is how Dufour is going to price the remaining 20th anniversary simplicity watches yet to be made ...

 By: als1678 : November 8th, 2020-10:35
And how long would it take for them to be recycled into the auction market.

Don't we already know watch collecting is not the same anymore? It has become a commodity and "investment"...

 By: Clueless_Collector : November 8th, 2020-10:41
Reason is simple...there are still passion but seem more about $ and cents....auction houses, blogs with the descriptions of "rare" and "highly sought after" helps, lol....

+1 Raymond 🤷‍♂️ [nt]

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 8th, 2020-13:52

Ummm 🤔...you might be...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:20
right ! Would the seller be a member of our forum?

It is a possibility ! Do you have any...

 By: GLau : November 16th, 2020-05:38
evidence to support illegal activities ?

Please let us know if you switch...

 By: GLau : November 18th, 2020-04:37
your profession to HOROLOGY ! 😉

Superb reply

 By: Weems@8 : November 18th, 2020-04:55
My notes. When i’m stepping in watch collecting, this was already going on. 2018. I do not know better the watch world turn to this. It reflex my direction, collecting watches which i can afford, and the watches which run to crazy price ranges are to fara... 

It wasn't me Gordon!! :-)

 By: sham1 : November 8th, 2020-10:42
Perhaps the effects of the pandemic has resulted in the owner being forced to sell his prized possession!

Hi sham, I will bet my ...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:22
life it was not you ! 😍

Sadly enough 😔

 By: Watchonthewrist : November 8th, 2020-13:06
I think a lot of ,,collectors,, nowadays are just investors

Yep, alas. [nt]

 By: amanico : November 8th, 2020-13:13

BIG +1 mon ami 👍 [nt]

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 8th, 2020-13:52

Hi Nicolas, so you think 🤔 it was...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:38
$$$ and not financial problems ?

Don't know about what Nico thinks but I would have to assume it was profit driven or a publicity stunt (worse case scenario)...

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 9th, 2020-09:55
Just cannot see someone paying a couple hundred thousand CHF for the watch if they were in financial trouble 🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️ That just makes zero sense.

+1! [nt]

 By: amanico : November 9th, 2020-12:04

LOL +2 😜😉 [nt]

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 9th, 2020-12:28

Exactly 🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️ [nt]

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 9th, 2020-13:11

I can guarantee that it wasn’t me... if I ever get this watch it won’t be sold in my lifetime 😏

 By: FRAMII : November 9th, 2020-13:16
But prefer it with a strap (Not my watch 😂) ...  

Allocation of those pieces is not made by ADs.

 By: Pretty Boy : November 8th, 2020-10:49
Decision is made in Geneva which makes the matter even more frustrating. However, since this piece appears to be rather unique, PP will surely be or become aware of the sale and blacklist the seller.

not at all....

 By: Peter : November 8th, 2020-13:04
more likely Thierry will assign more high end pieces to the seller so that PP can profit from the publicity they get from those sales. like us discussing how is it possible that someone has the audacity to make 800K USD by selling a wonderful watch:: )) w... 

You wrote what I thought.

 By: ronhan : November 18th, 2020-05:56

Hi ronhan, do you really think that actually ...

 By: GLau : November 18th, 2020-09:23
Patek is behind this particular situation ?

That's the point - I don't see anyone behind whatever.

 By: ronhan : November 18th, 2020-09:52
Someone bought a watch, was legal owner(!) of that watch, and finally sold that watch. Patek got what they wanted. Afterwards, the buyer/seller got what he wanted. Obviously, this whole thing is a problem for a few collectors only, because they never ever... 

Hi V, I understand that Geneva has the final say, but the AD did make the...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:41
recommendation and vouched for the buyer. Should the AD be partly responsible ?


 By: Chiranuj Bhirombhakdi : November 14th, 2020-17:17
Still upsetting to learn that after all these process, things like this still happens. Given the benefit of the doubt of Covid victims, ( I don’t think the person who can afford this kind of piece would be affected that much) still... AD should be fully r... 

Yes cbb, I thought the AD would get in trouble too because it recommended the customer !

 By: GLau : November 15th, 2020-09:48
However, my AD said that Geneva had the final say and did not think this German AD would be in trouble. Your thoughts 🤔 🤔??

Yes Fram, your comment is ...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:42
very reasonable !

This one was even more in demand 😏

 By: FRAMII : November 8th, 2020-11:21

Also, the diameter of the watch is 40,2 not 42.

 By: Erg2000 : November 8th, 2020-11:26
The owner must be known to Patek in Geneva and probably is risking to be blacklisted. Does anybody know how Patek is handling these cases?

Yep, I'm afraid there's no "probably" there. This was certainly a one-off approved by Geneva, so the name is very well known.

 By: FabR : November 8th, 2020-12:56
Barring (truly) exceptional circumstances of which I'm sure the original owner would have informed Patek, I can't really envision a situation in which he/she will ever be allocated another Patek in the future ;-)

It’s hard to believe whomever has discretionary spend large enough to get approval from Geneva to buy this piece would be under pressure to sell so quickly.

 By: Jay (Eire) : November 8th, 2020-12:51
One never knows however. I would ask if this is (big picture) a bad thing. Surely the price attained is a positive for Patek marketing. More interesting to me is that the 5131 seems to be softening (at auction at least). J sold for CHF65 and G sold for CH... 

Thanks, my assumption was the prices I saw on the app were not including BP. (Not sure why they can’t update those post auction quickly).

 By: Jay (Eire) : November 8th, 2020-15:46
Considering the dealer asks on these, the seller of both here is getting half of that maybe. Many times I really don’t know why sellers consign to auction houses as it would seem it’s far easier to just call a reputable dealer.

I have my own thoughts on this but there is no doubt that Patek wins out for the free publicity this auction will bring...

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 8th, 2020-13:51
Sadly nowadays, it's mostly amount profit and less about collecting 😕 😪 🤷‍♂️

Wow 🤩 JTCL you really think 🤔...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:46
outside the box 📦 !

ummm...the perpetrator could be ...

 By: GLau : November 11th, 2020-10:34
either or both.

Maybe PP knows something we don't

 By: benzng : November 8th, 2020-20:27
I am sure this will not go unnoticed but if they "allow" this or not is another question. Anyway, it's not our watch so we can't do anything but dream. They should allocate 1 to you Gordon, I don't know anyone more passionate for PP enamel dials. I don't ... 

Thanks Benzng for your kind words ! Unfortunately I do not have the....

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:48
$$$$ to quality for this piece 😢 Passion wise, I do qualify, right ?

Thanks for your interesting comments ! Do you...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:54
know this situation for a fact , or are you guessing ? The AD that sold the 5531 is based in Germany. Hence, IMO the owner had to pay Euro to this German AD in Germany.

sale & lease back ;-) [nt]

 By: psfparis : November 9th, 2020-01:07

Interesting thought ...

 By: GLau : November 9th, 2020-09:54
your had !

Sad truth

 By: Krittyot Vi. : November 11th, 2020-19:32
I know the whole story of where the watch was purchased from, price it was paid for, who got it first hand and then how it went through to the auction house. All I can say is that this is one big mess up transaction and deal. The promise was broken badly ... 

Hi Khun Krittyot, A warm welcome to our Patek forum !

 By: GLau : November 12th, 2020-01:12
Interesting that you have first hand knowledge of the actual events. While keeping sensitive matters confidential (such as names), are you able to provide an overview of what happened and how you became knowledgeable of the situation ?

Oh well....

 By: Krittyot Vi. : November 12th, 2020-05:45
It’s extremely sensitive. The Chinese guy was advised like a hundred times to keep the watch as secure as possible but he screwed it. Indeed, he would never get a chance to own this piece if not because of COVID-19. Not a money issue at all but this is al... 

Chinese buyer?!?

 By: TheCollector1688 : November 12th, 2020-06:07
I thought the watch was sold through an European location. Did the Chinese buyer purchase this via phone and shipment delayed or cancelled due to Covid19? I know there are travel restrictions in place for travel between EU and China. Buying a MR and piece... 

Wow 😳, I did not know that !

 By: GLau : November 12th, 2020-07:58
How did you come across this piece of information ?

Ok...agree to disagree

 By: TheCollector1688 : November 12th, 2020-09:42
Patek has been clamping down on these so called “deliveries”. If the watch is in the realm of a MR then I believe it has to be picked up in person. They will want an in person demonstration of how the watch works and make sure you understand it as well. A... 

Tough call

 By: Krittyot Vi. : November 13th, 2020-17:22
It was picked up in person. For this kind of super high end watch, forget about delivery, more or less the one and only watch like this. Unfortunately, something unexpectedly happened. I will not go into details.

Thank you

 By: TheCollector1688 : November 13th, 2020-18:24
Thanks for the update. Hope it’s not health related issues and the buyer is fine. Financial issues can always be “solved”, health then even with all the money in the world cannot buy...

PM sent.

 By: FabR : November 13th, 2020-19:30

+1, curious minds want to know 😉

 By: holdemchamp1225 : November 14th, 2020-11:39