Glashütte Original

to continue from the topic header; especially if the watch is worn in rotation with 9-10 other pieces..

I always thought GO was a company with great product line up and as a testament of this, I have bought 4 pieces over the last 2 years (retaining 3)..

BUT the recent experience I had with two of their watches have been not pleasent least to say..

I am very agitated and concerned with what has happened so I am determined to dispose all my GO watches and will never, ever touch the brand again. I should have bought Langes anyway, better late than never..

The story is as follows: I sent two GO watches for service; one losing time and the other requiring a polishing/case change. both watches are under warranty being 1+ year and 6+months old respectively..

the first one was fixed . actually during the process, they requested to charge me with a bezel change due to a crack on the bezel.  I assure you; when I left the watch to the AD for repair, there was nothing wrong with the bezel.

 after a number of e mails back and forth, the watch (sixties chrono) came back (the bezel changed with no charge) and to my naked eye, it is still losing time. will test the watch wearing 1 week everyday to test this before I firm my claim.

subsequently, I received another e mail saying that scratch  on the other watch (panoreserve XL) is very deep and it would requie change of the case. I happily authorized this and accepted the charge  because it was purely my mistake. (I rubbed the case to a marble table while having breakfast). 

this is all fine, but here is the catch; they are also saying that the movement is showing heavy wear from usage (a 6 months old watch!  worn in rotation with many others) and servicing this would not be covered under the warranty.

after this claim, I sent a number of e mails asking how and why heavy wear can happen in such a short period of usage, but the response was offering a small discount.

maybe I am just unlucky. but as a quant guy, having issues with 2 of 3 watches from a brand is too much for me to consider these "random events".

so GO watches is history for me. I never had any issues with my watches from JLC, Breguet, Blanpain and Rolex.. I am considering this case as natural selection process and continue buying and using watches from the companies that provides me best utility and problem free ownership for my money...

hope the above is a unique case but just wanted to share with the community to get it out of my system.

regards,

aziz

This message has been edited by Dr No on 2010-08-27 09:41:36

Just because you've owned it for 6 months does not mean it was only made 6 months ago, it could have been at the dealers for months, years even under those hot lights...

On the other hand, a warranty is a warranty and unless is says very specifically in the text "we can void this if we want" I would push VERY strongly to have them service it under coverage. Are you talking to GO direct or going through your AD? A

frankly, it's not about how much they try to charge. it's the least important aspect of the matter here..

if you are buying a luxury good or service, which is an emotional decision, not a rational one (to make yourself happy, justify your hard work etc), you are also implicitly or explicitly declaring that you are ready to "pay" for the whole experience.  whether it's USD500 oil changes or USD400 straps or USD1-2k servicing..

but it is just the overall approach of the company (or it's representatives)  that got me pissed off and made me vocal about the whole incident.

at this time, regardless of the outcome- I will no longer be a customer of this brand. period..

I wouldn't like having the AD in the middle, playing a game of telephone. Even with good intentions the messages move slower and may get slightly changed.

A

The same thing happened to me with a GO....

The AD told me that it needed service only after three months....
Probably it was sitting at the dealers window for a long time....

I would suggest that you get in touch with GO directly....

Having said that, I do understand that once you loose faith in one
brand it is very difficult for that brand to win you over....

Cheers

my own experience with GO service was fantastic and qite speedy. hope all work out in the end. i think its really unfair for them to charge you for "excessive wear"...6 mths, though it may have sat on hte AD's shelf for much longer period, but still its rubbish for them to charge for this.

it sounds tremendously frustrating, esp. to be charged when the watches are under warranty.  perhaps it is bad luck though.  you mention never having trouble with blancpains, but my brand new blancpain speed command had the rotor fall off after three months.  it was a watch that i rotated etc., but  the screw just came out.  and i would think that the company would be so embarrassed that they would insist on taking care of it immediately.  but the reaction never included so much as a "we're sorry."  anyway, i don't want to complain about blancpain, but just to say that sometimes it is just bad luck, albeit really irritating.

chris

I'm more of a lurker to these forums than active poster, so I'm not too sure I sent off the message properly. 

My one past experience with the Glashutte Original service department was very positive, but I've had less positive dealings with other brands, so I know how frustrated you feel.  I hope everything works out in the end. 

Let me know if you did not receive the message...

. . . that caused damage to the case of your PMR XL was of sufficient force to mandate case replacement, could the issue be one of translation? The service department might have written "heavy wear from usage" when the intent was to convey "incidental damage", which would normally not be covered under warranty. It wouldn't be unreasonable for a watchmaker to infer that damage to the movement was caused by the same incident.

As for the issue with the Sixties chrono bezel, there were third parties involved, so it also doesn't seem reasonable to assign responsibility to G O for their response. After all, the damage could have occurred while in the dealer's custody, or in shipping, and my take on their response is they were being exceptionally sensitive to the situation as they asked for your permission. Consider their position for a moment: they're in receipt of your watch with a damaged bezel . . . is it unreasonable for them to ask if the damage was your responsibility? I fully understand that the request was not well received at your end, but take their position into account . . . the other parties will likely disclaim responsibility. Their options are to either try to ascertain whether the damage was previously known to you, or to absorb the cost. What's instructive about this case is they deferred charging for the bezel, which speaks volumes for their sensitivity.

Truly sorry to hear that you're passing on G O for reasons due to these service experiences. I understand your feelings, but as an observer having carefully read your missive, my sense is that in both instances, Glashütte's service department acted with diligence and sensitivity.

Cordially, Art

be very much interested if it was a case of bad translation or not....

As I said, I also had to have a GO serviced shortly after I bought it
(but it could had been at my dealer's window for a long time)

Cheers

I tend to disagree with your conclusion in your post in regards to GO service department's diligence and sensitivity, and let me tell you why:

- The dent/scrach at the edge of the bezel is due to rubbing to the surface of the marble breakfast table. The watch has not been subject to a shock due to an impact/colluison/drop etc.

- While the above may well be my subjective view (that the "rubbing" did not cause a shock to the movement), I have not been informed by the service department that the service is in fact required due to a physical impact etc. And mind you, I asked, more than once, why there is a need for service at this very beginning of the watch's life cycle.

- Below is what I received from the service department re work needs to be carried. Please note that in addition to this, they have offered an optional change of bezel/case because there is a possibility that polishing would not 100% fix the dent/scratch, which I authorized.

Dismantling of movement, cleaning, lubrication & assembling

Checking all functions.

Replacement of worn out movement parts

Replacement of Gaskets

Replacement of Hands

Restoration of Water Resistant
Technical and aesthetical final check

Refurbishment of Case (to best possible extent)

Long story short, this is not a case that I want to spend more time on. There are a lot of watches in the market that I can buy/wear/enjoy and am sure GO has a lot of satisfied, loyal customers for their future offerings.

I again sent a note to the company about the reason of the "wear", as soon as they respond back and regardless of their reasoning- weather I agree or not- I will authorize the service and would like to get my watch back asap.

Hope above clarifies the matter and my point of view.

. . . the PanoMatic Reserve situation is one that could apply to any manufacturer under identical circumstances. When there's damage to the movement in addition to the case, the service department has to decide whether the movement damage is directly related to the impact that caused case damage.

My Senator perpetual had to be sent back to Glashütte for case repair after suffering a drop onto a tile floor; the case damage was my responsibility, but the movement was serviced under warranty even though it was still running after the accident as before. G O didn't have to service the movement, but did so anyways in the interest of their client. This was in 2005, before I became a moderator, so there's no issue of special consideration.

I wish we had the perspective of G O's service department regarding your watch. Presumably, it was running normally when you delivered it to the AD. It's entirely possible there was additional damage caused in transit, and their recommendation for movement servicing out of warranty has been prompted by an event that you're unaware of.

Cordially, Art

. . . they confirmed my surmise; not only was the case of your PMR XL damaged, but the dial had been 'displaced'. Under the circumstances, the service department has to disassemble the entire watch in order to return it in verifiably working order.

To put this in perspective, kindly allow me to share a story from another sphere altogether. I was recently treated in an emergency room for an asthma attack. I knew that the problem was asthma, and that my health was generally good. The on-call physician ordered x-rays and an EKG, presumably to rule out other lung and heart problems (I was deprived of oxygen and probably looked as though I was having a heart attack). Were these expensive tests actually necessary? From my perspective, no, but the physician's perspective is different . . . she had to rule out other reasonable causes before discharging me, partly for my benefit, but mostly to alleviate the hospital from liability in the event her diagnosis was off the mark.

In the case of your watch, the service department has determined that it has to be completely disassembled in order to perform cosmetic repairs. Once the movement is out of the case, they have to service it in order to be certain there are no hidden problems that might arise afterwards; it's more a matter of prudence than necessity. Our Man in Glashütte has informed me the cosmetic damage will be repaired without charge in light of the circumstances. Responsibility for the consequent service, however,will still be yours.

It's regrettable that accidental reasons resulted in service experiences that weren't well received. I understand your dismay at being asked to bear the cost of service so soon after acquiring a new watch. On the other hand, a manufacturer has a responsibility to recover reasonable costs, and that seems to me to be the situation.

Cordially, Art

Thank you for your follow up Art....



Cheers

ps. On a personal thought I hope that all is well with your health...

. . . that cleared up after emergency room treatment.

I received an e mail today on the same, pretty much in line with what you have elobarated below.  (what GO is undertaking as a sign of goodwill is defined slightly different than detailed in your note,  but the display of good gesture is what matters, not the details)

I truly appreciate GO service department's offer here.   I sent a note back and repeated my request for a full replacement of case + bezel, at my expense needless to say, as I originally conveyed.  

BUT, there is one note I need to add here, which I believe to be essential for GO and me, as counterparties in this case, to put things in a more objective perspective here:

I have been in communications with the service department, obviously in disagreement with a lot asymmetric information (perhaps better to say "assumptions" on my side) , for over 20 days and I have  been made aware of a "dial dislocation" issue only today (to my suprise) .  More importantly, this info has ben communicated to me -in my opinion- after your intermediation.

All in all, would like to thank you again for the kind help on this matter and  GO for the good gesture towards the resolution of the issue.

Best,

Aziz

. . . the Sixties chrono works out . . . cordially, Art

That could certainly happen within 6 months if the watch had been left too long without servicing: oils, grease, gaskets.

Or the watch had previously received a knock that put something out of alignment, before it was in your hands. It may be still keeping good time and show no visible defects, but there are surfaces grinding on surfaces. Only when the watch is opened will that become noticeable, unless the dial gives us a clue.

In the service report that GO sent you I see "Replacement of Hands", and in Art's great follow-up "dial dislocation". These things usually don't happen without the application of brute force - I suspect on transit. Believe me, I have seen crates of precision instruments literally hurled into trucks, no matter how the warnings were marked on the outside or the careful packing inside. That hurts.

Briefly a worst-case scenario, not necessarily yours, but it would be bad enough for me:

The watch is out of alignment, has been put on a high-speed winder with the chronograph running, or has been delivered to some place with the chronograph running and left outside exposed to high temperatures and possibly bumped about some more.

As for timing, I am always curious about what other people expect for accuracy. Your part of the world has a different temperature span than Glashütte or their assembly chamber. A sudden change from scorching heat to air conditioning or vice versa, may have an effect - if not on the balance wheel then on the oils.

Of course, the wearing habits of the individual owner play a noticeable role, depending on how one "rotates" and if the watch was kept wound (also by hand) between intervals.

I hope for you that your communications with GO's Servicing Department will continue to improve - with Art's great help! - and that you will be satisfied with their results, and do not put GO on your black list for future purchases. Perhaps you will even grow closer.

My GO Senator Rattrapante was running a constant 12 secs too fast for a couple of weeks after buying it. I took it back to the AD, here in Hamburg, and it is now -1 to +3, depending on the position during the day or night - and of course worn - whether or not the rattra-chrono was switched on or not. I never leave the function running unless I am using it for its intended purpose.

I also have an ALS Double Split that had been losing 12 secs, regardless of the position. Now it is down to 6 sec - still a bit too much for me - but I am not going to do anything about it for a month or two.

Both are great watches, for what they do and what they cost.

I hope that I have not shown excess (or excessive) wear on your patience!

amerix

. . . I vividly recall stepping out of an air-conditioned building in Bahrein into the 100º F / 100% humidity great outdoors and being instantly blinded by the sudden mist on my glasses! Damn near slipped, too.

Point well taken, Amery.

Cordially, Art