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Palladium
Started to see some brands such as H. moser, VC, Cartier to use palladium to make watch case. Can anyone share your experience of this new metal?
Palladium price is much lower than Platinum,with white metal color, harder and lighter, are these the main reason luxury brand starting to use it?
How does it compare to WG? Will you buy the watch made by Palladium if price is lower than WG?
Some excellent questions!
It would be worthwhile - at least for me - to spend at least a few hours checking out the chemical and physical properties of palladium, especially how it can be "worked" - by hand or machine - as well as its alloys.
This message has been edited by amerix on 2013-12-09 15:10:39 This message has been edited by amerix on 2013-12-09 15:16:25
Palladium belongs to the group of platinum metals. More than that I cannot say.
As for costs, there have been times when platinum has been even cheaper then gold, as traded on the world market.
But it is very hard to work into more than a watch case. The best of these require that the metal is cooled down to a certain temperature in a mold and rolled so that no bubbles of gas are entrapped inside. Then the shaping can begin.
The higher costs for the watchmaker are somewhat due to the broken tools required for shaping and engraving - as well as the sheer time and effort required.
The question of palladium's beauty and sustainability - that I will gladly leave to others.
Don't think only of the price for a metallic element, without considering the other factors involved.
And always - the marketing, the marketing ...
I remain sceptical.
Regards,
amerix
Palladium and WG
Hi all,
All the best quality 18K white gold, (not the 9KT high street costume jewellery stuff and the like), has a high Palladium content, so Palladium can be used in more ways than one ;-0) If I recall correctly, there were already a few brands about 10 years back who also used a purer form of Palladium a few times for cases but it never really ignited people's passions despite the fact that it is part of the Platinum family and roughly half its price.
It might catch on in the public's imagination today, why not, but I think classical Platinum will always retain a greater aura within the marketplace.
But there is no reason not to use Palladium for cases or other such parts; it is just a bit harder to work with than Platinum.
Ciao tutti,
Theodore
America and Theodore, thanks for your thoughts,
My understand is Palladium is lighter than Platium, but how about v.s. WG if made the same case?
If the platinum version priced at 100, what should be the reasonable price range for Palladium and WG? Should Palladium priced over or under WG? By what percentage?
I had a palladium VC QDI...
and I loved the watch, but it seemed to get hairline scratches just by looking at it. I had it serviced by VC and it came back looking perfect, so it can be refinished without a problem by the brands.
I wouldn't put any special premium on palladium compared with a white gold or rose gold piece. I'd only pay a premium for platinum.
To some palladium is considered more of an industrial metal than a precious metal.
FWIW, when it comes to white gold cases I find myself shying away from those that have the rhodium finish.
Bill
I wouldn't put any special premium on palladium compared with a white gold or rose gold piece. I'd only pay a premium for platinum.
To some palladium is considered more of an industrial metal than a precious metal.
FWIW, when it comes to white gold cases I find myself shying away from those that have the rhodium finish.
Bill
Precious metals
The pricing of precious metal cases for watches is always partly an historical/emotional issue.
The price of PT and gold are not so very far apart in the reality of the metals marketplace, but once it goes into a watch case, suddenly one pays a much higher premium for Pt.
Part of that can be (correctly) attributed to difficulties in manufacturing, with Pt being more tricky to deal with in certain aspects.
Nonetheless the premium for Pt is much higher than one would naturally expect.
So for Palladium, it is really a question of what price the market considers acceptable I suppose, since it seems these issues kind of defy logic as is were.
Rhodium finishing on WG cases is only needed for pieces were there is soldering and this needs to be equalised visually, or the WG quality is lower than it should be.
If a high quality WG is used (with high Palladium content) then rhodium finishing is not needed.
Ciao tutti,
Theodore
PT premium?
Is PT priced 50 percent premuim over PD appropriate? Some brands do so, just like to hear your opinion.
It is supply and demand and marketing I believe.
The amount of gold vs. steel and platinum vs. gold do not justify the price jumps. Scarcity, or what buyers will pay does.
Looking at the real numbers there are few things to consider with platinum for the same watch case.
Looking at recent prices, platinum is about $43.60 per gram and gold is $34.20 per gram for the same weight one would expect a 25%+ premium, but that is just the first consideration.
Second, platinum has a density of 21.45 grams per cc, and gold has a density of 19.30 grams per cc. The case of course will have the same volume, so here is another 12% by weight.
Third, gold cases will nearly always be 18kt, or 75% real gold while platinum cases are 95% platinum. Ignoring the alloy components as les significant, there is another 20% in the material by volume.
If a case is say, 5 cubic centimetres in volume, then there would be 21.45 x 5 x 0.95=101.8 grams of PT or 19.3 x 5 x 0.75=72.375 grams of gold.
So, i think it is correct to say there is more than 40% more platinum by weight than gold in the same size case and that platinum will cost 25% more.
However, after looking at all of the above there would have to be a 1000 gram difference in weight to make up $10k difference in price. It isn't nearly that material in something as small as a watch case.
As noted platinum is difficult to machine being harder and tooling needs frequent servicing. This adds some expense as well.