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This message has been edited by cazalea on 2020-06-24 17:36:22
Help with Armin Strom
this afternoon I discovered Armin Strom watches, I have a lot of independents but this never came across my radar until today. There are three pictures below and if you all could give my you opinions (advice is great) on them and the brand it would be greatly appreciated...Jim
‘This one is really cool, rather big at 43.40x13mm but a wonderful watch with a more wonderful complication. Price is probably $59K +-
‘This one is really cool, rather big at 43.40x13mm but a wonderful watch with a more wonderful complication. Price is probably $59K +-
This one is smaller and lees is more kinda thing, better fitting at 42x12 mm probably $50K +-
This last one is 1 of 10 in stainless steel and a Kari dial, smaller also in the 42mm range. Price is $18,600, a lot of watch for the mone
I edited your picture to take out your name and details
Cazalea
Not an expert on these...
...but like almost every independent these days, these are huge. I think the watchmakers have the skill to make them smaller (although that is yet to be proved), but they seem to prefer a big watch to fit in more complications or to just show off. My maxim has always been (and you can quote me)...anybody can make a big watch, it takes an artist to make one small and slim...
Thank you for the comments
I’m really focusing on the three watches in the photos, I know AS is bigger watches but two of then or not so big and I am only interested in those watches...Jim
If I may...
There are those who choose to create larger watches as a means to ensure long(er) term durability. I have heard Roger W. Smith mention in interviews he elects to make thicker timepieces to allow for more substantial components made to stand the test of time.
I appreciate your viewpoint, but it is important to realize we shouldn’t always chalk up what we deem to be overly large or thick watches to laziness or the inability of a brand or watchmaker.
I appreciate your viewpoint, but it is important to realize we shouldn’t always chalk up what we deem to be overly large or thick watches to laziness or the inability of a brand or watchmaker.
A fair point...
...but very disappointing that the consummate dress watch (pick your favorite Smith) should be made so thick. It's not like a thinner version would be 'in the shop' every few months.
Thanks Brandon very salient points
I could wear any of these watches but the two at 42mm x 12mm are not that big for my 6.75 inch wrist, honestly I don’t like thin watches very much. What is you opinion on the two resonances?...Jim
I took a trip on Armin Strom's invitation and wrote several articles about them: see links inside
Racing with Armin Strom and the Rain
Cazalea
Thank our so much but
The articles do not contribute to my questions, there are three watches I’m focusing on and two of them are smaller and mor wearable...Jim
You asked for input on the brand
Those articles contain the input I have to share on the brand.
I’d suggest you find a dealer and talk to them about AS reputation, service capability, waiting times, availability, strap choices, etc.
AS offers lots of options - are they what you want? Are the prices reasonable?
Are they really an independent manufacture or a small brand? What is the difference and does it matter?
Check websites for resale info - no doubt there are a few choices today but when I looked a few years ago I could find no watches for resale (leading me to wonder if just a very few had been sold, period).
I’d suggest you find a dealer and talk to them about AS reputation, service capability, waiting times, availability, strap choices, etc.
AS offers lots of options - are they what you want? Are the prices reasonable?
Are they really an independent manufacture or a small brand? What is the difference and does it matter?
Check websites for resale info - no doubt there are a few choices today but when I looked a few years ago I could find no watches for resale (leading me to wonder if just a very few had been sold, period).
Great points Cazalea
I have found a great dealer, I alway want independents but can be price sensitive and as you stated I cannot find enough data on these watches to ascertain the value proposition. Yes I believe they are independent with about 400-500 watches a year. The stainless steel model is different without the extra tab on the case at 6 o’clock, something I don’t care for on the others, it is a special edition for the dealer I’m working with and only 10 made...Jim
More about the Resonance
The 3rd one is a fantastic piece and great vue for money!
My pick is that one for sure
I agree with you and
It doesn’t have the tab a 6 o’clock like the others, I don’t care for that too much but it is not a deal breaker...Jim
I have seen all of them in person / in the metal.
They are all technically very accomplished watches and the movements are completely hand finished! When was the last time you saw a watch below 20k with a interior angles!? Yes, probably never...
If money and case size were no object, I would pick the first one. If case size is an important factor, I would pick the third watch which has a case diameter of 41mm.
I have been invited to an Armin Strom event here in Bahrain and I have had the chance to speak to Claude Greissler, the technical director, also at Dubai Watch Week last year. I feel they are at the core of the independent community and they deserve to recieve much more attention from collectors. In any case, with any of the three models you are getting something truly unique! All of the pieces can also be customized to the owner's tastes as you have probably seen on their web site already. Kindly let us know which one you are going for and we are looking forward to pictures and perhaps even a story about your journey in ordering and owning one (or more 😀) of these watches.
Full disclosure: I am in no way affiliated to Armin Strom, other than that I like the brand, I had good personal interaction with them and I am considering buying a watch from the company as well.
If money and case size were no object, I would pick the first one. If case size is an important factor, I would pick the third watch which has a case diameter of 41mm.
I have been invited to an Armin Strom event here in Bahrain and I have had the chance to speak to Claude Greissler, the technical director, also at Dubai Watch Week last year. I feel they are at the core of the independent community and they deserve to recieve much more attention from collectors. In any case, with any of the three models you are getting something truly unique! All of the pieces can also be customized to the owner's tastes as you have probably seen on their web site already. Kindly let us know which one you are going for and we are looking forward to pictures and perhaps even a story about your journey in ordering and owning one (or more 😀) of these watches.
Full disclosure: I am in no way affiliated to Armin Strom, other than that I like the brand, I had good personal interaction with them and I am considering buying a watch from the company as well.
Thanks LX
Very detailed reply and I appreciate it, these guys are defiantly driven by creativity and passion I agree the first one has everything a collector would want, the size is ok by me, I wear bigger watches but I would prefer it be smaller so the other resonance aesthetically is more appealing. The stainless steel one is compelling for my price perspective and also does not have the tab at 6 o’clock which I think is better… Jim
I think you probably enjoy the tecnical aspects of watches
because you picked the 2 that I feel represents the technical ambition of the company the best(2 because 1 is a repeat)
I prefer the Mirrored Force Resonance over the Pure Resonance because you can check if the balances are in sync or not through the two seconds dials, much like FP Journe Resonance. Though Mirroerd Force is bigger it would be my pick, as the Pure Resonance is not a small watch. I have this on order myself.
The Gravity Equal Force is also nice. From the interview podcasts with Claude Griesler I learned that this is the only watch with a Geneva stopwork combined with an automatic winding function(usually manual). Armin Strom calls it the stop work declutch. You can see the modified stop work on the front of the barrel cover dial side. The Geveva stop work is a less fancy way of flattening the torque curve of the mainspring vs the sexier fusee and chain or remontoir.
Through servicing old watches they have also reversed the function of the mainspring barrel cover and arbor in how the gears are driven. This reverse engineering brings back an older way of construction and the benefits are it protects the gear train in the event that the mainspring breaks inside the barrel. (I haven't really gotten down to how it works but overheard it on the podcast and thought it's very neat.) I have shortlisted this watch on my buy list.
The weakness in Armin Strom is probably the design, imo. I don't like the lip on the bezel(where u can customize with your initials), and I don't like the current technical look which is popular among modern brands. There is actually some level of hand finishing on their watches which is surprising because this kind of movement style is generally all machine finished.
The watches you have selected packs a lot of value for the pricing but I suspect the cost is backloaded when you sell, as the general market worships branding and not innovation.
Agreed
Agreed, The value proposition is probably not great, I’ve been collecting Watches for about 12 years now and have went through a transformation ending up pretty much with independent Watches and for the most part you will lose some money so you need to buy right. The gravity equal force is a compelling value proposition and I don’t believe the value would appreciate that much. The finishing a spectacular and the dial is from Kari albeit I’m not sure the blue is something I want to live with on a long-term basis… Jim
Like you i also just discovered the brand .
I wasn’t a huge fan of there old models from previous years but this year they came with some pretty cool and impressive watches . Was lucky to have a close look at these models when the Ceo of the brand was in my country last februari . Was planning to visit them at W
Thanks for your comments.
Discovering the brand was a treat and learning more about them through this forum is a wonderful tool to have… Jim
Thank you again LX
Very helpful these guys are definitely passionate watchmakers… Jim
Jim, all I can offer is that in the metal every AS I’ve tried has left me kinda flat.
Size was definitely an issue for me, and so that could have coloured my opinion. But it was more than that, the case, bezel, dial etc was just all very cold to me. I can’t articulate it well, sorry.
You absolutely need to get these on the wrist. That’s the best I can offer.
Re Resonance, if you haven’t looked into this do so. This is not the same execution as Journe, not to say it doesn’t have the same effect (physically and visually) but that it’s very different.
Thanks Jay I would love to try one on.
I have the new FPJ Resonance on order and can’t wait. The 3 Armin Strom watches I pictured are nice looking in the pictures. The new one, 41mm, is stainless steel and a reasonable price point for what you get. The only real question is How much will I like the the Kari blue Dial? It is a lot of blue, well done but still dominates the watch. In comparing watches I also have the new SS Czapek bracelet burgundy dial on order, a completely different sports watch but at the same price point which make me debate between the two...Jim