Jaeger-LeCoultre

I know that this is not an IWC forum but it is the closest thing to it here. And, fearing that I may embarrass myself elsewhere, I don't know who to turn to but you guys so if you would please bear with me. A few days ago I was stretching my left arm out of muscle pain and glanced to look at my Portuguese Seven Days at the same time (don't try this at home). Suddenly I noticed that the numbers "7" and "5" are not on the same level. Seven was a bit higher. So I went on to check the other pairs and came to the conclusion that...



All of the numbers are "heavy right"? I don't know if it is my eyes, a visual illusion or what. But look at the red lines above. I tried to place them right on top of the numbers on the right. And in all four instances the lines cut through the top of the numbers on the left. It doesn't matter if the watch is level because the lines are parallel with the top of the numbers on the right as you can see. The vertical gap between the marker and the number "11" is noticeably shorter than that between the number "1" and its nearest marker also.

I thought my sample is surely defective but what surprised me even more is that the watches pictured in the IWC catalog exhibit the same alignment issue.



Only the top and the bottom pairs in this black Portuguese from the catalog



But on all four pairs in this Portuguese Perpetual II.

Have I just discovered something unusual here or are all numeral watches made this way? I don't know what to think. This is the only watch in my collection with numerals on almost all positions. My other watches are either all markers or with numerals at only four main positions so I cannot compare. Shouldn't the numbers on the left and the right be level?

I wanted to post this on a forum with more Portuguese owners to check like the official IWC Forum but I think it is best for me to run it by you first. Thank you.

Ruckdee

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...a bit lower like the numerals. Thanks for the advice. At least now I know the three hand pinions are aligned.

Ruckdee

Classical fonts are designed following optical rules, which makes them indeed slightly different in size at the same print size. Some characters go below "zero" or end above "top". Making all characters exactly the same absolute size, would make a text looking optically unequal. At 10 the zero IS taller than one.

The white dial Portugese Perpetual is designed for its optical appearance : You cannot put the 8 on the same line as 4, because 8 would touch the year window. Putting the 4 higher leaves a hole between the minuterie and the 4. Same for 7 and 5.

You should not look at one single element, but at the dial as one element. The numbers you compare are "far away" from eachother. So it is more important to adjust the 8 with elements close to it - same for the others. your eyes are not jumping from one to the other side, but do follow the minuterie.

This message has been edited by magellan on 2009-10-11 11:00:43

...more clearly what you were so kind to take the time and explain to me. And I thought that there was no sense behind all these little details. Thank you for the insights, magellan.

Ruckdee

...I think on TZ some time ago, in a fairly heated discussion, if I remember.

Someone had noticed something similar to your observation, that the "4" on the Portuguese dial did not appear perfectly equidistant from the "3" and the "5", whereas the 8 appeared "correctly" placed between the 7 and 9.

A lot of back and forth ensued (ranging from parallax to weighting of numbers above/below their equator to placement of numbers on radial lines from the center).  Approached religion after a while.

I'll go with magellan on this one.  Dial is designed as a unified whole.  Arabic numbers in general present problems for typographers because their script origin does not readily lend itself to regular, linear placement as opposed to Romans.  Dial designers wrestle with these issues and come up with what they feel is the best overall solution.

Go ahead and fall in love with your IWC all over again 

-Tom

I tried to search for it for more background reading but to no avail. But regardless I am now relieved that my watch is not defective and that something rational is behind all these. Thanks again. I happen to wear the Portuguese today also.

Ruckdee

...with the link.

-Tom

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...re-reading it was entertaining.

In the end, you can look at this way:  any idiot can drop evenly-sized numerals onto a rectilinear grid imposed on the dial to achieve Cartesian regularity.  It takes patient human genius to create the integrated beauty of your Portuguese's face.

...and didn't I read somewhere that Mona Lisa's head is too big for her body?  What, am I going to second-guess da Vinci?!

 

-Tom

Forget about it. It looks great in my opinion - one of my very favourite IWC watches.

Cheers

David

You managed to give me a good laugh after a long day of hectic work, changed copies, bumped up deadlines and missed calls. Thank you, thank you.

Ruckdee

Seriuoslt though - I do love this model very much.

Cheers

David

There is an even better example - i have in my own collection: Do have a look at the dial of the Ulysse Nardin Maxi Marine Chronometer with arabic numerals. (There are a lot of pictures in the UN forum) 11 and 1 are in - geometrical terms - placed out of any range. On this dial there are no elements that force any displacement of the numerals. But there's no doubt, it is optically a beautiful, even weighted dial.

Nevertheless a very interesting discussion. I did myself not remark the "chaotic" placement of the numerals at the UN, just because everything fits perfectly as "one dial".

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