Patek Philippe

I am a watch collector that has decided to purchase my dream watch: the Patek 5970 as a 40th B-day present to myself.  Took some convincing but the wife is on board too!  This is a big "step up" for me, so as you can imagine, I am a little nervous and want to make sure I do my diligence.  Most of my six watches are priced in the 10k to 15k range, so we really are talking about playing in a whole different league.  I have done some research but would be very interested in the informed opinions of the participants on this forum.  I have a few questions:

1.  What would be a fair price for a (i) 5970 R, or (ii) 5970 G in either new or NIB condition?  I am hoping to pay about  $105k - 110k (5970 R) or $115k - $120k (5970 G).  Is this realistic?  I am basing this on what I believe market prices should be now, based on the totality of the circumstances (market meltdown, Wall Street bonus evaporation, etc.), even though I know that these numbers would have seemed low 6 months ago.

2.  I live in Northern California.  Is there a location/broker/dealer that you can recommend in the area?  Would it be best to go through an AD like xxxxxxxx?  Any thoughts on buying the watch from xxxxxxxxxxx (an *bay seller).

3.  For those of you that own the 5970, do you love it?  Did the initial "high" wear off after a few months of ownership?  How often do you wear the watch?  When you do, do you enjoy doing so or are you constantly paranoid about scratching the case?    

I know you are all very busy so I thank you in advance for any response.

****Grey Market Dealer deleted***

This message has been edited by DRMW on 2009-05-11 14:53:11

Hello and welcome to the PuristSPro forums!

I'm sorry but pricing/valuation/grey market dealers/fleabay are not allowed on the public forums ( home.watchprosite.com

Buying a Patek is a nice way of celebrating your bday (Happy Bday to you!).  Since you are currently in New York, have you visited the AD's in Manhattan and see what they have to offer?

-MW
This message has been edited by DRMW on 2009-05-11 15:04:46

Ooops!  I am new to the forum and I did not realize that I violated the forum rules.  Sorry about that.

So what attracted you to the 5970?

-MW

and please moderator please delete if inappropriate- that in this level and kind of watches you should avoid grey markets unless you know the seller very well.
Before buying, the advice given by DRMW is a very sound one- go to the ADs, check the watch and chose an AD that you feel that you can trust and develop a relationship. A great AD would be very valuable in case something goes wrong with the watch
cheers

since you're referring to metals that are no longer in production, you're left with either private collector or GD transactions.  It seems like you already have a price point in mind, in which case all you have to do is find a watch that you like.   As far as the question of getting tired of the "high" of this watch, all I can tell you is that it happens to all of us, no matter which reference it is.... there is always a "better one out there" for us to chase.   Just buy what you like.  There might be a few 5970J in AD's if you ask around.

No message body

I would consider it, but it would not be my first choice.  I think I would prefer, in order, a 5970 G, a 5970 R, then a 5970 J.  As far as I can tell, that seems to be the price pecking order as well, with abou a 10,000 gap between the models.

With 5970 temporarily selling for such low prices, now is a
good time to get this classic and highly collectible watch! I
don't know whether you will find someone desperate enough to
part with one in your price range, but it's certainly still
possible if people need cash right away in these times of
tough financial conditions for many people. But, getting too
greedy could mean you risk it getting priced out of your
budget once the market returns for this highly sought-after
watch.
Eric von Schonberg

Eric,

Thank you for the response.  I have seen too many home sellers these past years "chase the market down."  I don't want to do the reverse here and have to chase the market up.  I am just a little nervous since I am stepping up and into a market that I don't know really well . . . yet.  I know the market for Daytonas, two tone sub's etc., but this is a whole new ball game for me.  I have studied the "Collector's Market" forum here and am beginning to get a good idea of what this is going to cost me.   Again, thank you for your advice.  This is a really great forum for gathering information.

... heart. Its the same advice that comes to my mind everytime as in such matters, passion prevails. I'd go for the red gold, my favourite. The yellow gold gives it a vintage touch that is a safe bet to resist the test of time. Which brings us to the main point of your thread : How does your love for the watch evolves?
I have my theory about that, and u can apply it to any watch:
1- Go for the thunderstrick. The more intense u fall in love at 1st sight, the most probably that love should last.

2- The "purgatory" period : Comes after a while ( timeframe depends of ppl ) a strange period, where a loved watch doesn't make u vibe anymore. This usually happens when u wear it everyday for a long period... ( sometimes also when u keep it in the safe for a long period too ). This is the key point IMO. If u wear other watches for a while, ( couple of weeks or months ) then go back for ur watch, if u get the feeling that all the others u tried felt "ridiculous", then its definetly the "one"... u've passed the test of time, and that watch should do the main wrist time while others will come and go. That watch should bring u great satisfaction for a long time

3- Taste evolves with time. How many time did we feel that this or that watch was THE one and only keeper... before realizing that we were wrong , that another watch actually deserves that title more Its not only natural, but i think also healthy... IMO, one shouldn't fight his nature and go with the flow of what his heart tells him. Sometimes chaotic ( like me for instance at times ) but that is part of the pleasure of the game.

I personally love to wear all my watches and adapt them to different situations. My little secret to keep loving them more and more with time. Each watch reminds me of a trip, or an event,  or a special moment in my life. They carry memories that starts from the moment i ldecid to hunt them and the excitement of the chase.

You've made me smile when u mentioned the VP at MS or goldman. Met so many bankers that wears IWC or rolex. Tell me what u wear and i will tell u who u are
Good luck in ur hunt and happy b'day!

Karim

nt

No message body

It's the pleasure of this hobby
I have now decided that there's no such thing as Grail watch but there's Grail combo or Grail collection ;-)
Cheers,
CL

... or the wallet

Karim

not about the wallet
A perpetual calendar minute repeater may sounds like a potential grail but it is not in my book since it won't be worn too oftenly.
My grails must be very wearable watch , not a fragile piece in the safe vault.
It must be a piece that can grow old beautifully with me ON my wrist ;-)
*CL

No message body

I appreciate the response.

.. and keep us post 

Best

K.

And one's that I fully agree with. As I suspect do most of us.Thank you.

Mr Jenkins good luck with your search, it is a very beautiful watch and one that I would love to have, especially in W/G.

One more comment ... I'm not so sure there has been any bonus evaporation. While bonuses in many industries are tied to performance, that does not appear to be true of the finance industry. There, the basis of reward is merely continuing to remain alive. Consider, for example the AIG bonuses which rewarded executives *after* AIG had managed to lose $90Billion in only one quarter. Now, it's true that the US government stepped in to fix this problem, but I'm sure there were lots of less egregious companies which still had miserable performance, and surely each of the executives in those poorly performing companies got nice bonuses. Some of them will ultimately be considering a Patek to mark the occasion.
Eric von Schonberg

I have been an avid owner and trader of PP watches since 2001.  I regret to say that I think the market prices of all collectible watches (including PP) will continue their decline for the forseeable future.  I recall when the 5970 was available new sealed with a high 70's handle (2000) -- would urge this newbie to hold off a year or two and you may see 5970s back there again (or lower for a used version) ... hope this post is vague enough not to violate any protocols of the site.  Of course I am also thinking we are heading into a WW financial depression so reader should take my negative view in mind in weighing the value of my point of view.

especially when the 5970 was introduced in 2004 and not in 2000 as you have quoted. Maybe following your theory Patek may start having a 2 for 1 sale as well. Please keep us posted. Watches are not a money making proposition. The crazy watch market where people were making huge profits on resale was created by speculators. Now that the speculators have moved on, true collectors have the opportunity to aquire the models they desire to add to their collection.

So why are they saying that the 5970 was in the 70s range in 2000 when the release year of these watch was in 2004. Someone clear this for me please!!!!

they were referring to 5970's father: 3970?