TAG Heuer Carrera 1887 Calibre Controversy

WPS member · Horological Meandering forum

17 replies11956 views9 photos

SJX identifies the TAG Heuer Carrera 1887 as one of 2010's most significant products, not just for its technical merits but for the industry discourse it ignited. This article explores the controversy surrounding the movement's origins, its implications for Swiss watchmaking, and the unexpected power of online forums in holding brands accountable. SJX argues that despite the initial uproar, the Calibre 1887 represents a competitive and well-valued offering.

17 collectors discussing this on the WatchProSite forumJoin the Conversation →

is the TAG Heuer Carrera 1887. I mention this in the upcoming Business Times watch supplement to be published on 27 August in Singapore.

When the 1887 calibre went online in December 2009, it caused an uproar. Beginning on certain French watch forums and spreading quickly, the news got out that the new Calibre 1887 from TAG Heuer was not what it was cracked up to be. Nowhere in the press release did it state that the movement was based on a Seiko movement, the 6S37. Even though TAG Heuer would manufacture the movement itself in Switzerland, it only licensed the intellectual property from Seiko, the movement remained similar enough to the Seiko 6S37 for denizens of watch forums to notice.

The resulting furore brings to mind several questions. If one of the Switzerland's leading mass luxury watchmakers, and one of the largest in terms of output, can license technology from Seiko, will others do the same? But TAG Heuer is more open minded in its sourcing of components and technology, so it may be the exception.

Or might this provide a springboard for Seiko to market its upper end products overseas, since it now has some form high-end legitimacy? The 1887 is in many ways a more sophisticated movement than the Valjoux 7750 it replaces.

At the same time, the fiasco brought home the power of internet forums. Jean Christophe Babin himself responded on some of the forums. Several industry insiders mentioned this episode in discussions throughout 2010. One independent watchmaker branded this an wake-up call for the industry which has become complacent in its assumption on consumers' disinterest. This has caused ripples in a insular industry and many will proceed with care now.

The irony is the 1887 is actually an extremely competitive product. It is priced at a modest premium above the Valjoux 7750-based Carrera chronograph, making it good value. The new 1887 movement with column wheel and vertical is superior in terms of construction to the Valjoux. At its price point the 1887 is certainly one of the most interesting options and probably the most significant product in its class.

- SJX

This message has been edited by SJX on 2010-08-12 09:37:22

Key Points from the Discussion

TAG Heuer acquired the design rights from Seiko, allowing them to adapt and manufacture the movement in Switzerland, rather than simply importing it.
The primary issue was TAG Heuer's lack of transparency regarding the movement's Seiko-based intellectual property, rather than the movement's origins itself.
While manufacturing parts in-house is not inherently romantic, the significance of an in-house movement lies in its exclusivity and innovation, which was arguably compromised by the undisclosed licensing.
Several Richemont brands utilize Magic Lever-like winding mechanisms, a Seiko invention, in their newer movements, though without claiming it as unique.
The TAG Heuer 1887 marks the first instance of a mass luxury Swiss timepiece utilizing a Seiko-based movement, distinguishing it from earlier, less prominent examples.
The controversy highlights the growing influence of internet forums in scrutinizing brand claims and demanding transparency from the watch industry.
The TAG Heuer 1887, despite its controversial origins, is considered a competitive product offering superior construction (column wheel and vertical clutch) compared to the Valjoux 7750 at its price point.
The origins of a movement are less important than its execution and how transparently those origins are communicated to consumers.

The Discussion

SJX

Aug 12, 2010

And a more innovative product...

but one that remains a concept. The idea is a magnet-driven balance wheel on a Unitas base thus obliviating the need for a hairspring. The result is the TAG Heuer Pendulum Concept. From what I understand it essentially comprises four magnets that attract/repel thus generating oscillations in the balance wheel. The magnets replace the hairspring and because there is less mass the Pendulum concept allows for higher frequency of the balance wheel. Above mock ads are created by myself and are not of

chaser579

Aug 12, 2010

Sometimes you don't need to re-invent the wheel...

..you simply need to re-tread it! =:^D

219

Aug 13, 2010

Generally, and overall, TAG have been progressive not only

in watch technology but also in other areas such as sunglasses and mobile phones. I have a pair of the sunglasses and the 'wrap around' part from rubber is both useful (does not move) and very comfortable. Likewise, although I am not in the market for a luxury mobile phone, if I were I would probably go with the TAG phone as the build quality to my untrained eyes appears above others in the market. All very impressive and it should make the rest of the Swiss watch industry and luxury brands take

SJX

Aug 13, 2010

The Meridist phone

is fairly well received amongst the folk who buy such phones; it compares well to Vertu in terms of build quality. - SJX

Hororgasm

Aug 14, 2010

i humbly disagree!!

tag phone is better designed though, but built quality...Vertu is MUCH better

Tony A.H

Aug 13, 2010

very neat concept

i like what TAG comes out with every once in a while. they are innovative for sure.. thanks for the Pictures.