Spartacus
285
So much that I don't notice
I love the 4178 and have been looking for one, but I know very little about what to look for in a vintage watch. I show the ads to an experienced collector friend, and he has told me to stay away from most of them (mostly for suspected/undisclosed washed dials). I'm glad there are experienced people on this forum who can easily pick out things from photos of the movement as well. Perhaps I'll post pics of watches I'm interested in as well. Thanks to those of you who share your expertise with us. Cheers.
Dear Timeset, any opinion this 4178?
This is a very beautiful piece but like most 4178, it just sits with the dealer as people are afraid to commit. Can we use this piece for a discussion and let us know what you think? I'm curious what can be learned from this. ...
If you like it, and the budget suffices, why not?
Assuming cash funding is in place and you enjoy the model, the only reason not to would be a different watch that you enjoy more. It's not another vintage Daytona, and thank God or gods for that. Questions to ask: Have you worn a 4178? Does the size work ...
I have had several vintage pieces...
patek 2526, ref96, Vintage Grand Seiko... so size wise, it does fit. When I had Dufour simplicities, I had both 37mm and 34mm which I preferred the latter. I ordered a 38mm Kari Observatoir and I sold it right away because it felt big while a 38mm Journe ...
may I suggest always to consider at the same time both the diameter and the thickness of the watch?
Some "small" watches might look surprisingly big because of their thickness and, conversely, some "large" watches might look surprisingly small on the wrist. The worst watches, as far as I am concerned/ not my cup of tea, are watches that have both a larg...
You are correct.
From my experience, if the watch is large but flat, it will look bigger than it is. 40mm Journe feels that way. But when it is thicker, it feels ok. The new 42mm Journe tourbillon falls in that category. Lugs and bezel also play a big part. A 34mm Simplic...
I think the movement likely has issues..
Perhaps the listing price is just too high to justify purchase knowing that significant restoration work will likely be required.
May I know what makes you think...
that the movement has issues? Is it because it looks old. If so, that can be serviced. I'm not familiar with Vacheron servicing. Is it on par with Patek in term of price wise or a lot more expensive?
Absolutely
First, please understand that I have no training as a watch maker or in watch repair. However, since you requested my opinion on why I believe the movement may have issues I will supply. Also, I fully understand that there may be reasonable explanations, ...
LS - Done very well for the first sight
Sum up, a lot of questionmarks and red traffic lights. Maybe Vacheron won't accept it at all?
Since you are an "expert"
Why did you think and observe first. The question was directly to you in the post. And why did you took the credit from LS response
Because it is so obvious and easy to answer
And I was thinking about, how it could be that CL is active in the forum, writing 2000 messages and asking such basic questions. I don't think it's possible to give instant authentication, it needs time. I know LS therefore I answer his response.
The truth is you are not as good as you claimed
I need to warn the members here about one claiming itself as an expert. Look at the time stamp. You dont have the expert ability. So you waited till LS response then you took his credit away. CL already said in another post that 2 years ago you were askin...
Maybe the questions were not so basic as CL think or recognise?
You should check the questions yourself. I don't claim to be an expert, hehe. Maybe you ask someone, who could judge it, maybe Alex, to spot the errors built in. And I suggest you don't ask further and I don't answer any more. By by Teacher Yang
Hey timeset, you are the one
who said I was asking such basic questions. Not me. I just merely put the images out for discussion. I never think you are any expert but I see you as someone who is passionate about Vacheron. This is a forum to share knowledge and if you have your opinio...
For comparison..
Here is the movement photo from the listing of a V&C that I did buy -- my 6115. And I will explain my thoughts. good in green: 1) green circle on lug shows a deep stamp with some soil. this is good since the case was likely not over polished 2) soil b...
Thank you LS...
Your explanation is super useful for everyone. I really enjoy reading what you wrote. Thank you. So, based on what you've said, the dial is ok for the 4178 but the movement needs to be 'restored'. It will likely be 2 digit figures. 10-15k or are we talkin...
Pardon, but I think your interpretation exceeds the scope of my comments...
Kindly, do not put words in my mouth. I expressed no opinions about the state of the dial. I was only answering your question regarding my statements about the movement. And I was expressing my personal opinions about it. My opinion may be inaccurate and ...
Thank you for your clarification.
Your mentioning of the movement is accurate and tend to happen to many vintage pieces. Those are issues I am okay to deal with as most manufacturers will address it/restore it. Most collectors have no problems with movements part being restored and most w...
Second thought
What to think about this watch sitting at the shop and nobody is committing? And CL is talking about it like he need to advertise it. I guess the 27k USD not fitting the offer might be the main problem. If you look at the watch you would recognise, a quit...
When did CL advertise it
I read all the responses in this post. I dont see anything that he was advertising for this watch. What you do mean by your statement " And CL is talking about it like he need to advertise it. "
Thanks Teacher Yang.
I indeed never have any intention to advertise this watch, and especially when I myself am interested :P It's unfortunate that we have never crossed path before but I find your writing very interesting. In the past, there is one guy that I really like a l...
Hi Timeset...I think you misunderstood me.
I'm here for a long time and have been inactive for a very long time too. Why? Because I'm not interested in all these unnecessary politics and ego. In the earlier post, you mentioned that you have problem finding the watch I mentioned in Christies while ...
No worries...
It's okay. Your expertise can still be very useful for many others. Thank you for your time.
Nothing Okay
I suggest to ask some other better, maybe Teacher Yang, hehe Get happy with what you are able to get
Sure... Thank you.
Hope you are not offended. I did not try to put you on the spot by initialing a cordial discussion. We just start on the wrong path. Continue educating others.
You are funny...
How not to be offended by that freak show? ( but not you , your questions are okay and normal, even if somewhat hard to understand)
So much that I don't notice
I love the 4178 and have been looking for one, but I know very little about what to look for in a vintage watch. I show the ads to an experienced collector friend, and he has told me to stay away from most of them (mostly for suspected/undisclosed washed ...
Good Advice
Hello Spartacus, But in this case the comments above show little to nothing, only the limited abilities of those talking about it. Your friend gave a very realistic warning to you, stick at it. The good ones already gone (1:100), for now you could be happ...
LOL...
Yes, all the limited abilities talking about it ... hahaha. This is amusing. Thanks Timeset for the entertainment.
you laugh about something you don't understand
For you a more detailed answer. I did not comment anything specific about that watch, because I don't want to spend my time with it. My comment was a second thought, a summary of my first impression. I would have agreed with the comments of LS at his firs...
Thanks timeset.
Anyone who have enough experience with Vintage pieces will know that a badly cared movements are common factor and will be okay to consider during a purchase as the manufacturer will restore it. It is just a matter of how much one wants to pay for it. As ...
That is your problem?
"...And CL is talking about it like he need to advertise it..." I was talking about my impression - why I should apologize? I did not blame you anything, right, I was just wondering. And now I wonder, you are still that aggressive. I don't complain about ...
Thanks for putting my initial words...
You underlined those words I said, such as " very beautiful piece" and " afraid to commit". Obviously that's what you find them problematic. But why? This is indeed a very beautiful piece. So by saying a piece is very beautiful, I'm advertising for this w...
You ask, but you don't like the answer.
Your additional words speak for themself If you are convinced why not just buy it, and afterwards share your experice, we would like to learn all out of it.
Yes, I try to read
I try to read the number on the movement. It is extremly blured, scrached, not readable, also other markings, not readable - that's quite unusual. That's a warning: There is something wrong, not only the price. The movement has not only a worse condition,...
These are some good examples
of 4178 movements so others can use them for comparison should they be interested in this watch reference. This seller is willing to send the watch in to vacheron to achieve certificate of authenticity and, if failed, refund the money. If the dealer is so...
One correction here...
Movements of 492 caliber is slightly different from 434 caliber. So, the difference between the watches are correct.
Where lack of knowledge ends and attempted fraud starts
That seems to be a question. There is a contact at the FBI for that question: The recomendation for the aficionado: Don't miss to file your case.
Your reply on this is too extreme.
Fraud is not a small or casual accusation. You seem to be very personal with this seller. Maybe you have had bad experience before. Incase you say I force words to your mouth, this is exactly what you said about the seller. "Would I buy at this shop? Well...
Too Extreme?
My experience would be, if someone sell something like that stuff, those person would very well know what he was or is doing. The seller states he has 30 years of experience. And that would also mean to find more questionable on offer or already sold. S...
You started the request
You tried to question my competence. You tried to question my integrity. You tried to put me dishonest. You tried to make me angry. Do you really think I'm that stupid? Do you think I would guess something about that watch with out any knowledge?
I never forget but it is another thing when
someone accuse you of something you did not do. I do think to clarify the matter gentlemanly will clear all misunderstandings but it seems not. But, I do understand why and I will just skip this section. Thanks, Amanico.
I'm convinced it is very beautiful and
it is factual that people are worried to fully commit. Hence, the discussion. I was ready to commit to a vintage Vacheron after many years of absence from this manufacturer. After this episode, I will go back to vintage Patek and independent watch which I...
