Comments:
I quite like this Minerva 38 mm Pythagoremanual wind. Simple, thin and comfortable on the wrist. I use it more on the Minerva bracelet than I do the ostrich strap because of the weather in Singapore.
This pieces was made in 2002. Just before Minerva was sold. Montblanc the new owners needed a strong movement maker to help legitimise themselves and they found it in the cult following of Minerva.
Sapphire crystal front and back, 21 years old now. These watches were handmade by a small group of folks at Minerva. They only had about 10 people working for the entire company and Mr. Frey the owner would often write a personal note of thanks to each owner.
How things have changed … ☺️
#minervawatch
Minerva 38 mm Pythagore
I quite like this Minerva 38 mm Pythagoremanual wind. Simple, thin and comfortable on the wrist. I use it more on the Minerva bracelet than I do the ostrich strap because of the weather in Singapore.
This pieces was made in 2002. Just before Minerva was sold. Montblanc the new owners needed a strong movement maker to help legitimise themselves and they found it in the cult following of Minerva.
Sapphire crystal front and back, 21 years old now. These watches were handmade by a small group of folks at Minerva. They only had about 10 people working for the entire company and Mr. Frey the owner would often write a personal note of thanks to each owner.
How things have changed … ☺️
#minervawatch
Yes, things have changed considerably… those were wonderful times!
Will Montblanc service the Frey era vintage pieces like your wonderful example?
Thanks JJ
Yes, MB will service it if ever needed.
NEO-vintage pieces like this hold so much intrigue for me. The 1990s was the golden age for Swiss watch making. Glad to see more awareness of this these days.
Some folks think NEO-vintage is the same as vintage … but they are quite different. I find that neo-vintage is the bridge that links vintage to contemporary and that neo-vintage often holds the best of both worlds.
Classic looks, low production numbers and modern production methods and materials. And often fantastically affordable too ☺️
NEO-vintage pieces like this hold so much intrigue for me. The 1990s was the golden age for Swiss watch making. Glad to see more awareness of this these days.
Some folks think NEO-vintage is the same as vintage … but they are quite different. I find that neo-vintage is the bridge that links vintage to contemporary and that neo-vintage often holds the best of both worlds.
Classic looks, low production numbers and modern production methods and materials. And often fantastically affordable too ☺️
Agree bro. There is a very
short period of time when Minerva was still independent and run by the Frey family and the watches had display casebacks. Circa 1999 to 2002.
The case diameter sizes ranged from 34 mm to 38 mm.
The case diameter sizes ranged from 34 mm to 38 mm.
Love the two-tone and the bracelet...
...this is the kind of thing that IWC should be making...
Thanks. Agree sometimes less is
More.
The Minerva brand name certainly helps too.
I like 2-tone as well. Not for everyone but as I get a bit older and more confident in my collecting, I find that some level of variety within the collection is nice.
The Minerva brand name certainly helps too.
I like 2-tone as well. Not for everyone but as I get a bit older and more confident in my collecting, I find that some level of variety within the collection is nice.
A nice story as bonus
While your Pythagore have a lot of things i do not look for,
it belongs to u.
… there are Minerva watches that have a lot i look for.
Every Minerva is rare i guess.
I spotted sometimes online Pythagore models that have the right specifications i look for, but it are needles in the hey-stack.
Considering a Montblanc?
It is for me something when Montblanc hint to Minerva, but it redirect me to the rare models from a longtime ago. It are echoes of time, and very desire able echoes.
it belongs to u.
… there are Minerva watches that have a lot i look for.
Every Minerva is rare i guess.
I spotted sometimes online Pythagore models that have the right specifications i look for, but it are needles in the hey-stack.
Considering a Montblanc?
It is for me something when Montblanc hint to Minerva, but it redirect me to the rare models from a longtime ago. It are echoes of time, and very desire able echoes.
I agree Weems. I echo your sentiment.
I’m not that keen on Montblanc because they don’t put Minerva on the dial. The finishing is excellent … the prices are massively more than the original Minerva’s. So I go for the Minerva before they were sold.
What are the specs you typically look for?
What are the specs you typically look for?
Great watch. Love the Minerva story. I have a 38mm Pythagore pilot from the same series. NT
Here are a few pics of my 38mm pythagore pilot
Here are a few pics of my 38mm minerva pythagore pilot. I wear it on a Molequin alligator strap.
Nice watch you have but also lots of wrong information in your posts
Minerva was not sold from Frey to Montblanc but beforehand in 2000 to Mr. Gnutti. Only in 2006 the company was sold to Montblanc.
Mr. Gnutti tried to transform Minerva into a luxury brand with grand complications and also high prices. For this reason he hired Demetrio Cabiddu, one of the best watchmakers and technical innovators around. Under his management the Gnutti-Minerva developed chronographs and horological marvels, some of them being offered at six digits already in 2005, a year before Montblanc joined the game. Nowadays there are dozens of watches available from that era on different platforms, being offered for prices between 20 and 60k. Gnutti was not at all successful with this high price strategy for Minerva, and Montblanc saved Minerva from being liquidated. So what everyones crying out loud for, which is purely Minerva labelled high end pieces, has not worked between 2000 and 2006 and would not have worked in 2007 as well.
For proof see the attached screen shot and there are other sources available. It's easy to bash on Montblanc but beforehand one should get the facts right. They saved a marvel with lots of money and thought it wise not to follow the unsuccessful path of Gnutti but to rebrand into Montblanc-Minerva.
Thanks for your comments, allow me to clarify ...
To help me respond for clarity:
Minerva was not sold from Frey to Montblanc but beforehand in 2000 to Mr. Gnutti. Only in October 2006 the company was sold to Montblanc.
Marc-Oh yes, for sure. I did not say that the Frey family sold to Richemont/Montblanc. I just said it was sold. I left out that the first sale was made to Gnutti as that would have taken a whole bunch more of typing on what Gnutti tried to do with Minerva. I can see how one could easily assume that Richemont/Montblanc were the immediate buyers from the Frey's so thanks for making that clear.
As for the date of the sale, I too have seen numerous articles that quote 2000 as the date of sale. However, I recall seeing a press release that said 2002. This is the reason I said 2002 in my initial post. It's interesting to note that the papers of my Pythagore are dated June 2002 ... but that of course is the date of sale and not the date of production.
I am in touch with Beppe Menaldo (CEO/Director of the Gnutti owned Minerva) and I'll ask him if he recalls when exactly the sale happened. I'll also look through my archives to see if I can find the press release. Will update again here if/when I find out more.
Gnutti was not at all successful with this high price strategy for Minerva, and Montblanc saved Minerva from being liquidated.
Marc- Not sure if Montblanc "saved" Minerva ... or that Gnutti was " not successful". In some ways Montblanc saved Minerva (as they bought it), but lets also remember that Gnutti was charged in court for other things and his entire empire was therefore in jeopardy. I do not know if Minerva itself was making or losing money at the time. But I do know that they had to rework a whole ton of dyes and machines from Frey to adjust to what they wanted to do and this tool close to 2 years and lots of money. So yeah, perhaps more of an issue with Gnutti vs Minerva itself? I don't know enough about the sales and cash flow situation of Minerva at the time to have an opinion.
It's easy to bash on Montblanc but beforehand one should get the facts right. They saved a marvel with lots of money and thought it wise not to follow the unsuccessful path of Gnutti but to rebrand into Montblanc-Minerva.
Marc-Not sure where I had "bash on Montblanc" ... I merely said that I prefer to see Minerva on the dial and that their prices "massively more than the original Minerva’s". I did say that the finishing from Montblanc is excellent ... the pieces from Minerva Villeret that is.
Hope this clarifies andI look forward to hearing back from you. It will be interesting to combine our research and discuss further ... as some parts of Minerva to Gnutti to Richemont ownership are a little bit sketchy at times.
Best wishes from Singapore.
Thanks for your insights
and this article is in depth on which was done before Gnutti had to sell to Richemont:
One of my better friends is the at that time CEO from Montblanc, so my knowledge is based also on his explanations.
I guess your watch was just sold in 2002 as NOS from the Frey collection as the Gnutti team was working on totally new components for the known calibers and that took some time. As mentioned in the article they did not want to use 50 year old stock components as well as non-Suisse components.
And anyhow you have a very special Minerva with that original bracelet!
Quick update … Beppe just
confirmed that they (Gnutti) bought Minerva from the Frey family in November 2000. So you and the articles are correct.
I will still try to find the press release I read to see how I derived 2002 from it.
Thanks very much 🙏
I will still try to find the press release I read to see how I derived 2002 from it.
Thanks very much 🙏
Thanks … this article
By Magnus is excellent and one that I have referred to many times in the past. 👍🏻
Almost 20 years has come and gone so quickly. I really like some of the Gnutti pieces. Flamboyant dials with excellent finishing on the movements. I wonder if they made the dials themselves or outsourced it?
Thanks, I was lucky to get the original Minerva bracelet with my Minerva.
Take care and let’s stay in touch.
Almost 20 years has come and gone so quickly. I really like some of the Gnutti pieces. Flamboyant dials with excellent finishing on the movements. I wonder if they made the dials themselves or outsourced it?
Thanks, I was lucky to get the original Minerva bracelet with my Minerva.
Take care and let’s stay in touch.
I have the same as yours.
But I don't have the bracelet. I resolved the issue of the hot and humid HK climate by ordering a custom ostrich strap with rubber lining from Camille Fournet. Works really well, you should consider it.
Also, mine has a swan neck regulator, which I understand was a feature found on models sold on the North American market.
Thanks Boris. I’ll certain consider
The rubber lining option.
Yes, from what I understand, the American version have the swan neck. The ones for Europe did not have it. Also, from what I have read, the original Pythagore did not have the swan neck regulator. Therefore, some purists say without is more true to the original. Personally, with or without is both fine. I have another Pythagore 38 mm
with me that has the swan neck. It’s my friend’s piece and he asked me to sell it for him.
Do post some wrist shots of yours?
Any idea on the production numbers for this model?
If you are ever in Singapore, do PM me and we can meet up for a coffee.
I tried on another friend’s Pythagore 40 mm white gold Gnutti period piece. Not bad too ☀️
Yes, from what I understand, the American version have the swan neck. The ones for Europe did not have it. Also, from what I have read, the original Pythagore did not have the swan neck regulator. Therefore, some purists say without is more true to the original. Personally, with or without is both fine. I have another Pythagore 38 mm
with me that has the swan neck. It’s my friend’s piece and he asked me to sell it for him.
Do post some wrist shots of yours?
Any idea on the production numbers for this model?
If you are ever in Singapore, do PM me and we can meet up for a coffee.
I tried on another friend’s Pythagore 40 mm white gold Gnutti period piece. Not bad too ☀️
No idea about the production numbers.
But seeing how small the Minerva operations were under the Frey family management, it can't be more than a few thousands across all years and all 3 dials variations of the Pythagore II.
I love that other dial variation you posted, very Bauhaus in style. It reminds me of a wall clock that was in the kitchen of my uncle and aunt's house when I was a kid.
Here's a picture of mine:
I'll make sure I connect next time I am in Singapore. Have a nice weekend. Boris
I'll make sure I connect next time I am in Singapore. Have a nice weekend. Boris
You wear it well Boris ☀️
I think much mess than a few thousand made of this model. Maybe a hundred or two hundred Naznim
Yes agree, the “blue hands” version is superb and definitely has a bauhausian elements to it. Clean and minimalist features. It’s interesting that this model is hardly seen in the wild or for sale.
Here are some a video snd pics from my IG.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CwnUXXYxxo2/?igshid=NTYzOWQzNmJjMA==
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cn_73IQrhEV/?igshid=NTYzOWQzNmJjMA==
Catch you around bro 👋
Yes agree, the “blue hands” version is superb and definitely has a bauhausian elements to it. Clean and minimalist features. It’s interesting that this model is hardly seen in the wild or for sale.
Here are some a video snd pics from my IG.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CwnUXXYxxo2/?igshid=NTYzOWQzNmJjMA==
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cn_73IQrhEV/?igshid=NTYzOWQzNmJjMA==
Catch you around bro 👋