Onemorewatch
319
Thank you OP - some excellent advice.
I’ve never had any inclination to attend or bid for any watch using auctions however I recently received an unsolicited call From them prior to a recent antiquorom event in where they asked me if I wanted to sell any of my watches. I can only assume they got my number from some other forums I frequent I. Which to buy and sell and whilst they refused to elaborate where they got my contact number from the whole situation left me a little uncomfortable.
PuristSPro Advice: The Perils of Buying and Selling At Auction
Moderator Patrick_y lists some true scenarios of bad behavior at auction houses so PuristSPro readers can learn the mistakes of other PuristSPro members and avoid making the mistakes themselves. Don't miss this previous thread, PuristSPro Advice: Don't Bl...
Thank-You Patrick for a great and most useful post. If big league collectors also get conned, as in your example of Bill Koch, there's indeed good reason for everybody to be careful.
Personally, I've never tried to buy from auction houses yet, in part because of these unfortunate stories that periodically pop up. (In fact, I've bought all of my watches at ADs so far, though I realize I'm a fairly extreme example in this sense Some oth...
Absolutely good advice!
Yes, do double check and always inspect the piece in advance. Bring another person who will inspect it as well. The sport of auction is to not get conned. Unfortunately, my success ratio is only around 20%. I've had a lot of bad luck with Antiquorum and B...
Sorry you had to go through all of this Patrick, but thanks for sharing it, that's extremely useful!
The third incident is probably the most surreal, first thing I thought was that they were trying to build an insanity defense after the first two...Too bad that auction houses so often seem to get away with an unacceptable behavior, most likely because of...
Absolutely avoid an auction house if you can!
Only buy from an auction house if you HAVE TO HAVE IT and have done the utmost due diligence. Leave nothing to chance.
Frightening... But I lived that by myself, too.
Here is the link: www.watchprosite.com Thanks for this helpful reminder, my friend. Best, Nicolas
So sorry to read about your experience, Nico!
Having lost a significant part of your collection had to be hard enough, but then to have to deal with these crooks... Very sorry, my friend!
Dear Amanico
Reading about it, it is truly a sad story. I wonder if you have an update regarding the matter- did you follow the legal way? Also I read in a comment that you do not have fab or Twitter. However these two medias do offer a much wider publicity and could ...
Thank you, Patrick, for sure this post.
I’ve never even thought about participating in an auction at this point, but it’s good to know of these things if that is ever a route I think about. This behavior is just criminal. How have they not been sued to eternity for this type of thing. At best t...
Auction houses do get sued, but they generally quietly settle...
Or the auction house goes into collusion with the new owner of the item; NEW OWNER complains about something he bought at auction house; auction house helps by reselling the piece very quietly to another unsuspecting owner. The CURRENT OWNER keeps mum abo...
great read but imo the biggest scam is their commission
If a watch sell for 135K ... the seller wil get more or less 100K One third is commission fee for buyer AND seller Imagine if a real estate broker would charge the same costs The real estate puts probably weeks or months in one house ( showing it to clien...
Yeah... 10% from the seller, and 25% buyer's premium. It's crazy.
Auction houses are in existence to make money. Why make a little when you can make a lot? For that much money, one would expect them to have experts who care. In the end, it just goes to say; retailing, overhead, and sales/marketing is a very expensive en...
Not a scam but quite unethical
I like going to auctions and I once went to the open doors for a watch sale. They had a lot of nice pieces and I was able to discuss with the expert. I highly recommend to go before the auction and inspect the pieces that you might be interest in and disc...
Oh there are worse than that...
There are shill bids. Things that appear to sell but don't really sell (to create a future market). I can't say much and I can't indicate anything in particular since I don't have proof. And there are marketing stories that are simply products of an inven...
Thank you OP - some excellent advice.
I’ve never had any inclination to attend or bid for any watch using auctions however I recently received an unsolicited call From them prior to a recent antiquorom event in where they asked me if I wanted to sell any of my watches. I can only assume they ...
Avoid them if you can!
If you don't need to sell or buy through an auction house, best to avoid them. Wait until you have a problem with an auction house, it may be worse than "a little uncomfortable." I can tell, you're a fairly careful individual, I think you'll be okay. Just...
Oops on the spelling!
I don't claim to be a Banksy expert, apparently I even spelled it incorrectly. Apologies! Banksy admitted to building the frame with the shredder involved. He even posted a video on social media of him constructing the frame and testing it.
Great post..
I could tell some hair raising stories about Auction Houses but it’s best left to another time. Basically avoid at all costs.
Feel free to give us a taste during next Halloween...
We should tell campfire stories of the horrors of auction house mistakes... I remember, back in my Scouting days, we would tell scary stories around a campfire... We should have a group of watch fans around a campfire trading scary stories; I bet a lot of...
Are auctions really such bad institutions for watch collectors? I don't think so!
I fully understand when owners of stolen watches that turned up at auctions get hatred, especially when there is then no cooperation to reinstate proper ownership. But I believe such watches will also find their way to “brick & mortar” dealers, only that ...
Excellent comments as well! Thank you for sharing with us your experiences...
Definitely nobody is going to ban you for your fine post above. So no worries there. I thank you for your thoughtful and well crafted response. Fortunately for you, you've been the recipient of good service at an auction house. This probably happened beca...
I'm glad you got into auctions before the World Wide Web became mainstream
All these horror stories are not made up and they seem to be during the Internet Age. None of the auction houses are suing us for defamation or slander.
Probably happened before the internet age too...
But probably back before the internet age; auction houses were more "gentlemanly" perhaps? Fewer mistakes were made? When mistakes were made, the auction houses took care of the customers better? Who knows... But I know this much, since I started buying a...
Way too long after 90 days for Paypal to do anything...
Credit cards and Paypal won't do anything after 90 days. It may take a while for you to notice the problem. It took me many months, maybe over a year, until I got the watch to the factory (I live in USA, not in Europe) in Europe to get the watches restore...
Definitely. There are successes at auction.
But many people who are regular buyers at auction houses eventually get burned. Some of them come back. Some of them stop. Look at Auction Houses dealing with Rudy Kurniawan, the famous wine counterfeiter. The auction houses knew some of the bottles seeme...
I think when you buy very old stuff
with spotty provenance or dependent on experts with conflicts of interest, there is very high probability of a conmanship going on. Auction houses are not the only places where these things happen, they just happen to be the most high profile.
Thanks!
I just saw a documentary called "Sour Grapes" this weekend about Rudy Kurniawan, the wine counterfeiter who was making fake vintage wine in his home and was selling millions worth of wine at various auction houses. Apparently, the auction houses were gett...
So great points Patrick :)
There are also some good buys as well and not all auction houses are scammers too... I think it is just to be cautious, go and see the watches in person (or someone you trust). I bought watches in auctions and so far have been lucky but then I am not buyi...
Thank you Andrew!
Yes! I would much rather buy something from a friend whom I trust. I've bought a lot of things at auction; not just watches, but other collectible items. I can definitely say I have a lot of problems. And although I'm very careful, I feel stupid now for a...
This is a great post
Damn these auction houses. I rather own less. I for own am really not that thrilled to participate at an auction. Neither do I have that much money to spare
Nobody likes to spare money to be cheated...
Even Bill Koch, one of the wealthiest men in the world, doesn't have money to spare to be cheated. You're on the right path!
