aaronm
2923
A fantastic reference
Neither Britten nor Daniels, my two goto references for watchmaking, use guilloche, so I had to go hunting on google. Britten uses 'guillochis' as a French term for 'engine turning' and that seems to defend my position on hand-engraving not counting, but that is using 100 year old words, slightly out of context, crossed with their modern meanings (Talmudically acceptable, but not very convincing). One thing that turned up was a fantastic set of technical references on the topic:
The more how-to technical reference
www.pledge.co.uk
The overall "everything you ever wanted to know"
www.pledge.co.uk
Guilloche patterns....
An excellent recent post by Kong in the Breguet forum alerted us to the fact that Breguet had created a new guilloche pattern for the 2009 Classique model 5967 – they’ve named it the “Art Deco Damier” (see the post here: click here ). How appropriate, rea...
Beautiful dials, pplater.
Sadly, I can't contribute, but I am looking forward to others' contributions. Best, Jed
I like this topic...
Guilloche patterns can add so much class to dials (and pens, jewelly etc.) One of my favourites is the JLC Reverso a Eclipses with a sunray guilloche patteren used to illustrate - yes you guessed it - sunrays in an emaille painting. Great example of funct...
Hi pplatter.... you are right!
Hi Pplater, A worthy mention. Guilloche is a remnant of an original quality watchmaker's working skill, which has sadly been 'counterfieted and copied' by many, even by some very famous and respected brands, in the form of metal stamping or even fine prin...
Great stuff Jack...
...the work on those watches pays great respect to the tradition of the guilloche effect and of the house in question. Great taste! Cheers, pplater.
Guilloche,
sorry I can't claim the name of most of these, especially the last 4......
Thanks Steve...
That MOP Lange 1 dial is always mesmerising. For those amongst us too lazy to visit your [seminal] "Watch Launchpad" website, any chance of posting a few more photos of the intricate and difficult guilloche work on that dial? Cheers, pplater.
They are not Guilloche...
Hi Steve, 3 of the last 4 are not guilloche... but what I mentioned as stamping. Although thee photos provide a good comparison of the difference between the real thing and make believe..... especially in the case of the Seiko, which by the way would have...
More Breguet
looks like a varient on the flinque pattern, probably trying to be waves The dial of the Revil du Tsar is also cut-down to make cufflinks And then there's the Breguet of divisive styling, the dual-tourbillon Finally I present 2 horrible pictures of engine...
Fond memories, Aaron...
...of seeing those cufflinks together in Paris (and trying hard to look casually disinterested when the assistant mentioned the price!!). What about Chopard? You must have some shots of their guilloche dials somewhere in your vast cache... Cheers, pplater...
Chopard and Metalem
I don't have any good pics of chopard's guilloche dials. All I have are this through boutique window On the other hand, Metalem does their dials I believe, at least the high-end dials, so you can see better pictures of their work elsewhere A...
Ahhh, Metalem...
...how could we ignore this work? - Again, though, the definitive photos of this watch are to be found on SteveG's site. Cheers, pplater....
Here are a Couple: Chopard and Zenith
Chopard 8 Day - radiating pattern from the center: Zenith GT Flyback...
Here are a couple, though I don't know the terms to describe them
Copper Sinn Copper RGM Gerber Goldpfeil This message has been edited by cazalea on 2009-08-25 14:55:31...
Whose is the work...
...on the Goldpfeil, Mike? Was it Frank Jutzi's own effort or was it outsourced? Interested parties need to know! ;-) Cheers, pplater.
I wish I could say; no telling
This watch has captivated me and there are always one or two allegedly available from dealers I know. But there is of course usually a watch or two ahead of this one on my wish list!
Another pattern "invented" a few years ago
by Thomas Prescher using the golden mean principle. Completely done by hand and found only on his tourbillon series, he called it "guilloche triangulaire" Cheers, Mike...
I don't think that qualifies...
At least in my book guilloche needs to be done on some sort engine, either a rose engine or a straight-line engine. My recollection is that is hand-engraved entirely, so fantastic but... A
Controversial!...
(Especially if you are right - as is likely the case!). Any [other] experts able to weigh in on the point of difference? Cheers, pplater.
Eeek, a review of my notes show that TP actually was referring to the
pattern on the dial as guilloche triangulair based on the use of the equilateral trangle as the basic cell structure. The movement decoration as shown in the previous post is hand engraved and the pattern is based on the triangular pattern of the dial rep...
From my woodworking days...
...not that there were very many of them...Guilloche referred to the spiral-like patterns created by a rose lathe. Not unlike those patterns you made as a child with a compass. So "straight-line" guilloche would seem to be a contradition, engine-turned or...
definition from the fondation de la haute horlogerie
glossary Engine-turning ( Guilloché ) (In French: guillochage ) A style of hand or machine engraving with intersecting wavy or straight lines. When the piece is moved horizontally or vertically against the tool, the finished effect is guilloché , compared...
That's an odd definition indeed
If I'm reading it correctly the main area here is guilloche and this is not (from RGM) A...
A fantastic reference
Neither Britten nor Daniels, my two goto references for watchmaking, use guilloche, so I had to go hunting on google. Britten uses 'guillochis' as a French term for 'engine turning' and that seems to defend my position on hand-engraving not counting, but ...
That reference is excellent.
Will definitely be doing some reading. I agree with your earlier post with the 2 dials as comparison. Straight lines are just that, no matter how one meshes or intersects them. Guilloche requires a Rose lathe, have fun getting a straight line from a roset...
2 more from Kari
I'm not sure if he does his own dials or if they are outsourced. A...
Good news...
...but that must be a very recent development. The 'anoraks' amongst us (count one here!) will be intrigued to see if there is any appreciable difference between the outsourced dials and the in-house product. Out of curiosity, were Voutilainen and Haldima...
That would be very recent indeed.
As of early July, Kari was still outsourcing to the Parmigiani dial subsidiary (sorry, I don't know their name, but their facility is in Fleurier, just across the road from the Parmigiani head offices). Kari has amassed a large collection of hand-powered ...
A couple of Peter Speake-Marin dials
Peter's love of classical watchmaking I'm sure lead him to develop a series of guilloche hand done dials. Here are a couple of my pics: The Eolienne Clos du Paris Rose du Desert This was a one off, sort of "mistake" which Peter actually liked, so he decid...
Breathtaking!...
Do you know the name of the pattern Tony? That watch is superb. Would it be fair to describe those lugs as "Cornes de vache"? Cheers, pplater.
I was a bit surprised that guilloche could be done with CNC milling
I personally tried my hand on a rose machine and failed miserably. I guess everything is possible with computers nowadays. This message has been edited by Allen on 2009-08-27 13:17:39
