Dje
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The Rolex effect.
To begin with let’s state that there are quite a few Rolex watches I like and I’d be happy to own.
And I clearly think that Rolex watches are just the best choice if you want a tough and water resistant watch.
Still I owned an Explorer 1 that I liked a lot but sold it mainly because it seems that everybody recognized it. I don’t live in a rich mens world. People in my life recognize generally only Rolex watches.
And in the last years quite a few people knowing my interest in watches asked me if I could help find a Rolex. They wanted to buy one to make money on it.
I can’t evaluate what share of Rolex buyers want the watch and what share want to make money. Quite probably more people looked for the money and less for the watch in the last years.
On my side I don’t buy Rolex watches because my budget is limited and for the price of a Rolex I get so much better watches (IMVHO). I ended up never buying a Patek Philippe mainly for the same reason. I love them (much more than Rolex watches) but I feel them so over valued.
Maybe someday the market will turn back and offer new opportunities.
Think about it …
Think about it and see past hype … 😅 Over 10,000 “rare” Daytona’s for sale. 17 Laureato-Olimpicos Chronographs for sale. (22 subtract 5. Five of the listings are not Laureato Olimpicos). Moderators, This post is not about sales. It’s about discussing hype...
So much for some ADs claiming...
That allocation must be personally approved by senior management to ensure that the buyer is not a flipper.
😂
No, I’m not trying to topple Rolex … I have mad respect for their strategy and marketing teams. What I am trying to do get certain people to THINK more. And Rolex might be the “KING” to you, but not to me. 😅 🤝
It must be that demand outstrips this
In addition to people holding out for high prices thinking they have this chip they want to cash in 🤷♂️.
Perhaps it’s also many having
Large interests in them. We know how it all works … Brands, ADs, Auction Houses and Influencers, secondary market dealers. All have vested interests to protect and deep pockets to create hype. That means buying their own stock when needed to create the “m...
Chrono has MANY fake ads.
Plus pricing is waaaay too high as compared to Facebook's MODA group.
Well.... agreed, tho if you want to target a wide audience, spam out the most popular FS ads.
Tho yes, there are less MB&F LM101 hand made EVER in the history of time... than Rolex Daytonas made in just a week. Everyone knows the Daytona. And Rolex. MB&F... not so much, and that's ok. No hype, just true genius and ultra-fine quality
Sounds like hype to me.
Genius marketing I agree Ultra fine quality… really? Paris Hilton effect. Famous for being famous. 🤝
Welcome to 2025.... where some still hype Holy Trinity. Love this thread, as *true luxury* means it is not necessary at all.
Hype... marketing... btw Paris Hilton is long expired, old, and outdated.... Agree about hype, but add LVMH, Swatch Group, Richemont, Ferrari...... whatever at Monaco..... Around here we love Cleetus McFarland. Perhaps on this side of the pond we enjoy th...
😀❤️ I actually quite like Paris Hilton.
And yes, don’t get me started about “The Holy Trinty” marketing rubbish that some still quote as gospel. Hope collectors deepen their understanding and navigate through the smoke and mirrors. Time for bed for me. 🤝 PS Cleetus McFarland is awesome 😎 🧢 ...
Last one before bed 🛌
As you mentioned NASCAR I thought I’d mention a fun fact … the Laureato-Olimpico 8017 was made (in 1996) when Luigi Macaluso was the owner of GP (20 years of ownership that needed when he died suddenly in 2010. The was a champion rally car driver/navigato...
Paris Hilton is old and outdates, sorry.
Also, a new Trinity has been decided. In the future within publications, posts, etc, please know that the Modern Holy Trinity is MB&F, H. Moser, and Rexhep Rexhepi. When referring to the Holy Trinity, it now reflects these three brands. Times they are a-c...
Who decided who the new “holy trinity” are?
I know Max. I think he will be quite tickled to hear this. 😅
Production numbers …
Rolex makes about 1.3 million watches now. (Correct me if I’m wrong) GP makes about 6,000 watches per year now. I got this on pretty credible standing. The laureato-olimpico 8017 had 999 pieces made in theory. But in practice I think about 600 made in tot...
I don't get it. You're comparing a limited edition GP to a whole line in the Rolex catalog and then inferring hype based on number of listings?
Again, I'm not saying the Daytona doesn't have more notoriety, I just don't understand how this comparison quantifies that.
Allow me to explain …
The model from Rolex is Daytona. Many many were made in a multitude of variants. The model from GP is the Laureato-Olimpico. 999 were made (possibly 600) in steel. 3 dials colors. That’s it. So I believe that folks may want to take a look at the rare bird...
I see. Ever since my friend got his first Rolex last year I'm fine with the hype. I showed him my rare 1 of XX whatever and he was like that's nice for me as a married man but try explaining that to a girl at the bar and see how fast she runs away. 😂
He is living his best single life and a Rolex fits better in his day to day than anything ever made by GP no matter the value or rarity. It's a reminder that for most, watches are a lifestyle / fashion choice and for those people they will derive zero ben...
Ha ha. Nice example. Made me laugh
It’s exactly what I was saying. Thrills for the inexperienced new collectors to flex. I call it the Paris Hilton effect. Famous for being famous. (See my other comment on this) Hype is all about posturing. It’s also reality(Their reality and the type of p...
I can confirm that both you and Marc are not the guys in bars trying to impress members of the other sex, or just other dudes !
And so your pursuits, NVGP and the finest of the fine respectively, suit you both well. That said, and Marc and I discussed this in person, Rolex have done an incredible job in selling the dream. They have also combined this with quality production at sca...
😅 well said …
No one said to stop buy Rolex or don’t buy Rolex. I’m not sure about finishing and quality with Rolex but I’ll stay on point here … When it comes to collecting, some have blinders on and have completely lost the plot. That was the purpose of my post. For ...
I think many re-sellers are currently nursing extremely burnt fingers.
Not going to mention any names but here in the UK one big reseller with an international presence and a very big corporate owner must of thought the market high was never going to end and they had a license to print money. I don't think that actually work...
Nice post and appreciate your sharing
I think that indeed the market is reeling across the board. No doubt. It is a good time for collectors to start collecting again. And looking at rare birds and leave the mass made ones to the masses. 🤝
Your love and dedication to the brand is undeniable and I truly appreciate that, however when it steps in to blindness it’s something else!
First off, there’s different production numbers by both brands and the demand is not just created by marketing teams, but more so by the quality of the product which is far above the Laureato! Do you really think people would buy a Rolex if it wouldn’t be...
Appreciate your comments
But in reject you assertion that it is me that is “blind”. Let’s be specific here … please see my response to FastWong above. I will not get into which watch is better with you. But I can certainly say which watch is more rare. And that would be the GP la...
Again, I value your enthusiasm!
Imposing superiority by quoting books, is impressive to the masses, but sadly does not change the reality(I have red the book)! Also, I like and collect Rolex from way before the hype and I don’t care if it will become worthless and as I expressed numertt...
Glad to hear you value my enthusiasm ☺️
So, I think you are still missing my point. 1. The book is a children fairytale that is not meant to impress you (nor the masses). It’s often used to illustrate a point of mass and groundless hysteria over something. The Paris Hilton effect. Famous for be...
I think you misunderstood my replies!
1. Everyone can find comparisons in life to prove any point, because that’s life, different angles. 2. The Daytona is not hyped more or less than any iconic watch from any brand regardless of production numbers. 3. If you compare the Olympico to Daytona c...
I appreciate your enthusiasm about your watch and its rarity..but the realitiy is rarity alone doesn't mean anything....
I bought a Carl F. Bucherer tourbillon limited to 30 Pieces. Now that the brand will no longer exist I would probably struggle to sell it at 50% than the original price. Even Bucherer CPO programme wouldn't touch it 😊 now any daytona is like cash. The dem...
Always about resale value …
For some reason, whenever I say anything about Rolex, the “other side” starts talking about resale value. 😄 (maybe this is exactly what’s wrong with watch collecting today 🤔). So let’s be clear. I said nothing about resale value in my original post nor in...
As you can see in my previous posts I definitely go against the grain
and always enjoy watches which are more unique vs. Rolex. I completely agree that wearing some more exclusive (smaller brand, rarity) can be very rewarding.. but you should have made a post "why I love my GP more than a Daytona" showing that there are mor...
Thanks for sharing your advice
I’ve stated my points quite clearly I think so yeah … not more more to say. Buy and like what you like. It’s your money and your prerogative. The responses from the various rollie boys is quite telling and not unexpected IMHO. Glad to get people thinking ...
The Rolex effect.
To begin with let’s state that there are quite a few Rolex watches I like and I’d be happy to own. And I clearly think that Rolex watches are just the best choice if you want a tough and water resistant watch. Still I owned an Explorer 1 that I liked a lo...
Well said bro 🙌
You summed it up perfectly. I’ll add … for a tough and rugged watch for sports and such I’d use a G-shock or no watch at all. (I was on the judo and rugby teams in college and nope, no watches allowed) 😅 🤝
Actually not quite as simple as this reductionist approach
There is hype around the Daytona. Why? Because there are many vested parties that make it so. There is little to no coverage of the Laureato-Olimpico. So what you don’t know about, you can not search for. It’s a bit like folks that think Indonesian beache...
I am sorry but is not because "vested parties" make it so...The Daytona is
one of the most successful watches of all time. For good reason, any watch collector/lover can see why as soon as you handle one. Everything is pure perfection and it looks great. I would say that the Daytona is not a hype or not a short term one. I love ...
I’m really not gonna get into a crap fest
Or say anything derogatory about another watch. Some may view it as “constructive feedback” but no one asked me for my opinion. All I said is “Think”. And it this post triggers some to think more deeply about what they feel and know ha what they have been...
I like GP, and have a Laureato Evo myself. However, is there any historic importance to Laureato 8017
other than it was the first Laureato chronograph? Cost and hype aside, why would a collector choose Laureato 8017 over Daytona? The thing is, if rarity is the only reason, one can find far rarer watch than the Laureato. Also 17 out of 600 is 3% of Laureat...
Thanks for your question and sharing your thoughts …
So, you raise some points which are worth further discussion: 1. The distinctions of the laureato-olimpico 8017: - first laureato chronograph made. - to mark the Atlanta Olympics 1996 - first time the GP calibre 3170 was used. - the last time the olimpico...
Part 2
You asked … Why would anyone choose a Laureato-Olimpico 8017 over a Daytona ? I say: A) why not? What does the Daytona have that that the 8017 does not? B) Whats is the Daytona famous for? C) I never said for collectors to choose one over the other. I sai...
Part 3
Rarity: 1) rarity alone is not enough. I agree. My 5 year old niece drew a picture of cat using crayons 🖍️. It’s very rare as only she made it. Who cares beyond me right? But GP is not your run of the mill watch company. They have patents a mile long. So ...
Part 4
I do not know how many Daytonas were made. A percentage to percentage comparison will not work IMHO. The point is absolute numbers. Many many many thousands of Daytonas were made. Maybe 300,000? I’m really not sure. I estimate that 600 made of the laureat...
Part 5 - both … some real pics
As mentioned in part 4, my buddy has BOTH. He said he loves the “quality, heritage and comfort of his 8017”. Here are two wrist shots from him. Re-posting here with his permission. 🤝 ...
The biggest issue to getting collectors in on something like this is the brand cache
GP is very low in awareness compared to other brands. Collectors and people in general tend to want pieces that can speak for themselves. A Rolex, a Cartier, a Royal Oak - everyone knows what they are and their position in luxury. This GP? I’m sorry, it l...
Agree … that’s why I’m posting to start awareness
Your points are valid IMHO. I even post in the AP FB groups and they have been quite welcoming. I also collect AP and they know and appreciate my research that I share openly. We must also remember that GP had a tiny production back in the 1990s. For exam...
I appreciate a lot your passion and enthusiasm for sharing your knowledge
You’re doing your part. It is up to GP to help themselves.
Think about they made around 1.25 million watches last year and tell me they are rare 😬
Ofcourse its about demand too but its easy to understand there will be a substantial amount on the market within a short period of time. Not sure how much Daytona,s they make a year but it wont be just a few 😬
The hype is still going strong…
There isn’t any logical explanation to this. Here Rolex has a high volume standard product but yet commands significant premium in the secondary and used market. For sure it is not rare but can it be explained by any conventional economic or consumer beha...
Thanks SF for your balanced thoughts on this
In my humble personal opinion … … It is a long and complex answer about GP. I have written extensively about what they have been doing wrong and why. I’ve spoken with Patrick on this as well. There are different agendas for different brands. The Rolex pla...
Not sure how volume produced makes it better (or worse)
Quite the opposite … There are tons of Tag Heuers produced each year as well. If rarity, provenance and hand finishing does not matter … then one can certainly think highly of the Daytona as well. Don’t get me wrong, I have nothing against the watch itsel...